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Monoroller Question

Oct 12, 2018
11
5
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Texas
I've never owned, nor used a rollergun of any sort before. I'm interested in this Italian monoroller and it appears to be simple but I want to make sure I understand how it works and the limitations before I purchase something this expensive.

Here's what I'm looking at:

http://seahawksub.com/prodotto/veleno-95/

It looks as if you load it like a normal gun, but then flip it over and there are 3 different length positions for the bottom to be stretched to and it requires a metal rod / tool to get a good grip on it. My main question is: will the gun still work (at a lower power) if I leave it on the first position and forego using the tool? I can see many situations where I would need to load the gun quickly and it appears to take a considerable amount of time to get it all set up between shots. Also, is it possible to fully load the rubbers without this tool? I prefer to limit the amount of gear I need to carry/have on me whenever possible, especially when shorediving.




^Video showing what I'm asking about^


Thanks for your time,
Fred
 
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Mr. X

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Jul 14, 2005
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Wow. Looks great. Super-light - yet no recoil - and exceptionally maneuverable too. Impressive :)

Yes, loading looks a bit time-consuming (like all rollers or multi-band spearguns I suppose). The power is OTT for those grey mullet, a regular single-band speargun would be more than adequate. Perhaps the second-stage of loading is optional? e.g. normal and "powered up" modes perhaps. Actually the second stage looks like it has mid-way stop option, to ease loading and, perhaps, another lower-power option?

It just struck me that multi-stage load guns (rollers, inverted rollers, multi-band guns), as well as being slower to load also require you to load a gun that is already partially loaded (i.e. "live").
 
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Dreaming_Of_Blue
Oct 12, 2018
11
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8
30
Texas
Exactly, extreme caution needs to be taken when loading an 'already loaded' weapon, hehe.

But, yeah I still want to know if the pin is necessary, or if i can just grab it like normal (maybe there is too much tension and my gloves will get stuck/it will hurt my fingers??? seems to make sense..) - and also, if there really are these multiple power modes we are talking about here. It would be awesome to just be able to load it normally on the top side and hunt as per usual, then *BAM* something larger moves in and catches my attention; just whip out the pin and 'power-her-up' for the opportunistic, longer, shot.
 

Andrew the fish

Well-Known Member
Oct 17, 2010
377
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Burnaby BC Canada
I also thought these sea hawks are insanely expensive. But then I started shopping around for bits and pieces for building my own roller, and all of a sudden sea hawks are only marginally expensive. If I look at them long enough, I might end up buying one of those.

Mr. X. You mentioned mullets, and I agree those aren't big fish. However they swim kind of briskly and keep the distance. These Sea Hawks look very promising for this kind of fish.
 
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Mr. X

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I like the look of it. Without the roller, it would still be an innovative, cool looking speargun and probably even more manoeuvrable. But then it would likely suffer recoil, to some degree, having no roller benefit and being low mass, and perhaps muzzle-light? Perhaps the roller is an important, intrinsic part of the design.

It wouldn't make sense for me. Here in the UK v. large fish are now uncommon and visibility is often poor. So smaller, simple, single-band guns, which can be loaded quickly, are usually a better option, cheaper too. :)

If you really want a roller and can afford it, go for it. Spearguns can last a long time, just don't loose it! ;-) Spearguns, esp. nice ones can often be sold on later.

Sent from my S99 using Tapatalk
 
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Dreaming_Of_Blue
Oct 12, 2018
11
5
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30
Texas
Indeed, I mean - looking at other carbon guns (Rob Allen - Wahoo Carbon for example) it still fits in right around the same price point. Probably a PITA to load though with all of that shooting line and wrapping going on. The recoil from other videos I've seen looks insane though, the gun barely moves.
 

Kodama

Well-Known Member
Jun 20, 2016
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I am sorry to say but to me this speargun doesn’t look impressive at all. Besides the setup the overall shape looks unpractical and needlessly complicated. They made all the cutouts to make it track well sideways but the problem is that this only works if you keep the gun perfectly perpendicular while tracking. Most often this is not the case when you like to swing a gun fast! You get more leverage on the handle if you tilt it.
As soon as you move away from perfectly vertical tracking will be awful with such a shape. It will either move up or down depending how you hold it or move very slowly.

Overall I am also not drawn towards the aesthetics but that is irrelevant since it’s personal taste.




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Mr. X

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It looks remarkably manoeuvrable near the start of the above video. The long loading process/time and the need for the steel pin/pull-bar - which I would surely drop and loose - would be my main concerns. And price.

At one time the use of carbon might have concerned me but having used carbon barrelled Spearguns for several years now, I think it should be used more.

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mariusshobo

Well-Known Member
Sep 22, 2013
180
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romania
Really nice gun and good set up (Sigal shaft and handle).
It's strange that you have to use a metal rod to load it, but for 540 Eur I can get used to it. No joke, the price is very fair for this gun.
If it shoots well, I'm in!
 
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Dreaming_Of_Blue
Oct 12, 2018
11
5
8
30
Texas
Yeah Carbon is the way to go. I started with an aluminum gun and moved to carbon. Night and day difference. The carbon gun (100cm) tracks sideways so quickly it really is amazing. One day I would like to try a nice, well balanced wooden gun however.
 
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Dreaming_Of_Blue
Oct 12, 2018
11
5
8
30
Texas
Also, for those people new to complicated setups (like me heheh) here is a video demonstrating how a similar gun would be loaded. This answers the question about using the gun "powered-down" I believe:

 

Kodama

Well-Known Member
Jun 20, 2016
335
125
58
Belgium - California
www.eastwind.be
I have been using the Pathos Sniper roller for a few years now and must say that I never use it as an all purpose gun. Powered down I find the performance of rollers even worse. They shoot low inherently and with the bands tuned down another notch lower. On the reef I carry two guns, one for shooting at distance and one for hole hunting. This way I always have the proper tool for the job.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Andrew the fish

Well-Known Member
Oct 17, 2010
377
61
68
Burnaby BC Canada
They shoot low inherently and with the bands tuned down another notch lower.
I wonder if this is something that can be cured. Enclosed track, different shape of sharkfin or muzzle design, there must be the way to fix it. It must have something to do with shaft release, when wishbone slides upward on shark fin while still pre-loaded. I never had roller, but this is where I would look.
 

Kodama

Well-Known Member
Jun 20, 2016
335
125
58
Belgium - California
www.eastwind.be
The Pathos Sniper roller has an enclosed track and it sure does not solve the problem.

Actually it is because of the inertia and gravitational force of the rubber band that turns over the roller that the wishbone is lifted.

Inverted rollers that only have dyneema running over the rollers don’t suffer so much from this problem since the dyneema has much less mass compared to a rubber band.

I am actually moving away from rollers again going back to a classic setup. Much simpler overall and you get great performance.
A roller gun is not going to yield more fish, better skills will.


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Dreaming_Of_Blue
Oct 12, 2018
11
5
8
30
Texas
I have been using the Pathos Sniper roller for a few years now and must say that I never use it as an all purpose gun. Powered down I find the performance of rollers even worse. They shoot low inherently and with the bands tuned down another notch lower. On the reef I carry two guns, one for shooting at distance and one for hole hunting. This way I always have the proper tool for the job.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Thanks for sharing your experience!
 
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Kodama

Well-Known Member
Jun 20, 2016
335
125
58
Belgium - California
www.eastwind.be
Kodama. This matter interested me enough to look for solution. Apparently Ivan Palumbo hs a beautiful fix o the problem, look here:

http://www.nadirspearfishing.com/en/updates/technical-advices/328-roller-up-the-low-trajectory-solution

it is in line with what I thought, look at the drawing made by Ivan

That is an interesting point of view. But I wonder if it’s true why have none of the great builders have picked up on it?

It makes me think there is more to it.
His hypothesis could be easily tested with two of the same guns where one has the adjustment and the other not. Do a pool test with the guns mounted statically and the difference is measured easily.

But again if it’s that easy why is it not common practice then?


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Sep 23, 2015
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San Francisco, CA, United States
One of the major additions in modern roller setups is the kicker band. Just an additional, non roller band fixed to the muzzle. I would opt for this feature when buying a roller for 2 reasons: it gives you an additional boost of power to your roller if you want it, with little hassle. Also, in the event you need to quickly reload and take a shot, and you don't have time for a 3 step loading process, you can just use the traditional single kicker. It may not take down a yellowfin tuna, but then again, maybe it will.

In terms of inverted rollers, I would only recommend in warmer water. Here in northern California, it's common to use 5mm gloves, so grabbing a tiny Spectra loop with clinky gloves is a pain.

I personally would avoid that Seahawk just on the loading pin. You'll fumble and lose it eventually. Check out the Scorpio spearguns, or Gladiator Spearguns you want an aggressive looking invert roller with good engineering behind it.
 

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Kodama

Well-Known Member
Jun 20, 2016
335
125
58
Belgium - California
www.eastwind.be
The kicker band on the Pathos certainly does it’s job.
When you are in the water hunting keeping things simple is so crucial. After some years of using rollers I don’t recommend them to beginners anymore.
Keep things simple and focus on the quality of your diving and hunting techniques. That will make the difference not the gun you are carrying.


“I hate storms, but calms undermine my spirits”
 
Sep 23, 2015
69
24
23
32
San Francisco, CA, United States
When you are in the water hunting keeping things simple is so crucial. After some years of using rollers I don’t recommend them to beginners anymore.
Keep things simple and focus on the quality of your diving and hunting techniques. That will make the difference not the gun you are carrying.
This is a great point. Even for myself, as an experienced diver, I sometimes find myself fussing with my roller much longer than preferred while in the water. This can result in missed opportunities and simply wastes time. Don't overlook the classic setup, as it will always be the mainstay of spearguns, and for good reason.

and on that note, might be worth even graduating from classic roller to inverted.
 
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