[News] Global Warming: Media Hype ?

[Dignan]

Fonduest, I think some of those are very sensible statements.

Sure it's getting warmer now, but a person living in 1970 could say with complete accuracy that there is way more snow now (1970) than when I (ficticous observer) was a kid.

I don't think anyone claims that burning fossil fuels is good for the environment. Stand behind a semi truck idling for ten minutes and you can pretty much figure out that petroleum emmissions are not good for you, traffic jams are obviously harming more than just our nerves. So what's the solution? Should we all freak out and run around like a bunch of chicken littles with our heads cut off? No, we should seek alternative fuels, sorry we should CONTINUE to seek alternative fuels. The fact is that there are no solutions to the problem right now. All the other fuel systems put together could not generate enough power to fuel the world, if they were put into place tomorrow. And they would be cripplingly expensive.

The govenment is constantly putting into place more stringent emmissions standards for IC engines. (i know when i bought my outboards a couple of years ago the big thing was that they complied with 2006 emmissions standards). The oil companies can see the writing on the wall, they dump massive ammounts of money into R&D for alternative fuels. SO the next time you see a petroleum industry executive (refer to the recent senate hearings if your not sure what they look like) at your local Walmart or at a McDonalds, give em' a hug.

And i pose a question....

For those of you the KNOW the truth about the reality of global climate change. Those that have seen The Day After Tomorrow aaaaaand An Inconvienent Truth, What should we do? What do you propose is a realistic solution to the problem?

 

[Fondueset]

I believe a 10cc syringe full of fish emulsion injected surreptitiously into the door locks of every SUV you can access without being noticed is a good start.

 

[Dignan]

I believe a 10cc syringe full of fish emulsion injected surreptitiously into the door locks of every SUV you can access without being noticed is a good start.

Why don't you start with Al Gore's private jet...or does it run on solar power?

 

[Fondueset]

My reasons for disliking suvs go beyond gas mileage. I have to admit it's an indulgence. I withdraw the remark. I wasn't running on all eight when I made it.

 

[roy_nexus_6]

Global Warming: Media Hype

Can someone remind me; did we have SUV's and "evil oil coporations" during the ............. Middle Ages ?
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"Claims that man-made pollution is causing "unprecedented" global warming have been seriously undermined by new research which shows that the Earth was warmer during the Middle Ages.

............. A review of more than 240 scientific studies has shown that today's temperatures are neither the warmest over the past millennium, nor are they producing the most extreme weather - in stark contrast to the claims of the environmentalists.

The review, carried out by a team from Harvard University, examined the findings of studies of so-called "temperature proxies" such as tree rings, ice cores and historical accounts which allow scientists to estimate temperatures prevailing at sites around the world.

The findings prove that the world experienced a Medieval Warm Period between the ninth and 14th centuries with global temperatures significantly higher even than today.

They also confirm claims that a Little Ice Age set in around 1300, during which the world cooled dramatically. Since 1900, the world has begun to warm up again - but has still to reach the balmy temperatures of the Middle Ages. "

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/mai...lim06.xml&sSheet=/news/2003/04/06/ixhome.html

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Like I said before: "Global Warming" is more of a religion then a science.

 

[Dignan]

Roy,

I'm going to head em' off at the pass. The inevitable response is going to be that, sure it was warmer back during the middle ages, the earth experiences natural cycles of warming and cooling. The problem now is that the earth is warming too fast. Way faster than it should. Which is really inconvenient for eskimos.

Well folks. This type of data does not represent lame neocon attempts to lull people into the illusion that global warming is not real. These are just rebuttals to the claims made by the global warming blowhards.

 

[roy_nexus_6]

rofl rofl rofl

Roy,

I'm going to head em' off at the pass. The inevitable response is going to be that, sure it was warmer back during the middle ages, the earth experiences natural cycles of warming and cooling. The problem now is that the earth is warming too fast. Way faster than it should. Which is really inconvenient for eskimos.

Well folks. This type of data does not represent lame neocon attempts to lull people into the illusion that global warming is not real. These are just rebuttals to the claims made by the global warming blowhards.

 

[Fondueset]

This is easily expained by the well-known temporal climactic displacement which occurred when the aliens invaded in 1949. As a result weather from the future was displaced to the middle-ages. This kind of thing happens all the time.

 

[bjpete]

Before you starting slamming SUVs please think about this, Is it better to drive an SUV with 4 or 6 people inside or to drive a "lawn mower" with just 1 person inside. The net result is the same for energy consumed per person.

 

[Fondueset]

easily 80% of the SUVs I've seen have one person - a woman in her 30s* - in them and she is talking on a cell phone. Not that I'm talking about that.

Also - How do you fit a person inside a lawnmower?

*this percentage is considerably higher in brentwood, hollywood and santa monica

 

[roy_nexus_6]

easily 80% of the SUVs I've seen have one person - a woman in her 30s* - in them and she is talking on a cell phone. Not that I'm talking about that.

Also - How do you fit a person inside a lawnmower?

*this percentage is considerably higher in brentwood, hollywood and santa monica

Interesting observation. Indeed, majority of my environmentally concerned neighbors drive an SUV on their way to worship at the Church of the Global Warming. Could this be the effect of the cell-phone radiation ?
Come to think of it, there is a worthy cause to get behind.
Imagine, being able to hurt the evil cell-phone companies and save the SUV driving cell-phone using people from the evils of the global warming and cell-phone radiation at the same time !

rofl rofl rofl

 

[Dignan]

Kind of reminds you of bookmakers tweaking the spread in the days leading up to the Superbowl, huh.

forecasters Lower Hurricane Predictions
Aug 08 11:05 AM US/Eastern
Email this story

By JESSICA GRESKO
Associated Press Writer

MIAMI

The 2006 Atlantic hurricane season should be slightly less active than originally predicted, federal forecasters said Tuesday.

Forecasters now expect there to be 12 to 15 named storms and seven to nine hurricanes, the National Hurricane Center and other National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration agencies said.

Three or four could be major hurricanes with sustained winds of at least 111 mph, forecasters said.

Government scientists made their first prediction in May, saying the season could produce 13 to 16 named storms, and eight to 10 hurricanes, four to six of which could become major.

There have been only three tropical storms and no hurricanes so far, but August through October are typically the most active months of the season.

The revision follows that of forecasters at Colorado State University, who updated their forecast Thursday. They reduced their storm estimate from nine hurricanes, five of them major, to seven, with three to five major ones. The forecasters initially had called for 17 named storms but now predict 15.

 

[spaghetti]

easily 80% of the SUVs I've seen have one person - a woman in her 30s - in them and she is talking on a cell phone.

Il puttanone!
Woman, 30, in a SUV with cell phone: that's the category of persons that here in Italy we commonly refer to as "Il puttanone" (the grand bitch).
No offense for anyone, of course, but I felt you needed to know this.

PS: alpine glaciers are shrinking and subalpine regions are running out of water. The big debate among subalpine farmers' organizations is about what to grow in the next years instead of the traditional corn and rice, since corn and rice require more water than now available. Being discussed in the current weeks.

 

[laminar]

Okay, I'm bored with this conversation already, although I really like Fondueset's data about the aliens. An important contribution, if there ever was one.

I agree with Paul about the fact that humans think they are way smarter than they actually are. It's true. We're "dumb all over and a little ugly on the side." At this very moment, I believe that I can make a post that will wrap up this argument nicely, and close it forever. Send Roy back to the neocon incubator and the rest of us back to the ice age, where we can cool our boots. Ha, ha, ha! What a fool I am!

But I can't keep my mouth shut. :duh Time will tell if Global Warming plays the trump card. No doubt we'll still be arguing about whether the Great White Shark of Environmental Studies exists or not and then next 50 years will let us know whether there will be more droughts, hurricanes, flooding, disease, crop failures, forest fires, water shortages, erosion, species extinctions, coral reefs killed off, riots, wars over dwindling natural resources like water, oil, and food, and fist fights over every man, woman and child's god-given right to blow CO2 into our atmosphere.

So whether or not you believe GW to exist or not, what do you propose for the next fifty years? Imagine you can direct government policy. Imagine you can influence all your friends and their friends and their friends to change their ways. What would you say? Status quo? Everyone keep on truckin'? RoyNexus, do you see any need for the American Dream to be modified? You can bet that in 30 years when China is richer and more powerful than the old US of A, we'll get to see the consequences of that approach to life and everything.

I'll stick my neck out:

The most important thing for us to do is: Don't Buy Crap.

What do I mean by crap? Anything that can't be re-used, recycled easily, composted or rebuilt to last. It's really that simple. We are the ones causing pollution, whether it results in Climate Change or not. Don't blame Big Oil alone. Certainly they have big problems, but we all buy the stuff every day. So don't buy crap.

I know this is the least popular stance, but it's really the only one that makes any sense to me.

I really would like to freedive with fresh air in my lungs and fish in the water where I dive.

 

[unirdna]

I think ol' bjpete makes a good point. I see this discussion slipping into "I'm doing more (eg "better) than others" - which is then met by the sceptical with contempt and inevitably rolling laughy faces (likely meant to stab further, rather than to actually depict genuine humor). I think pkotik did well to return civility to the conversation; I think all sides should follow that lead whether they agree with his arguments or not.

There has been much talk about historical temps. I have not the sources to confirm or deny these statements. What I do know is that carbon dioxide levels are higher now than any other time since we've had the instruments to measure CO2. This is a factual quantity, and has shown to be on the rise. It is also very very very likely that the sudden increase has been caused by man burning various things to create energy. We might explore the rate of CO2 increase, and ponder how high of atmosphereic concentration is attainable before something changes.

If the earth goes through natural cycles of heat/cold, do you think that we can manipulate our ecosphere as much as we want because these cycles are immovable?" For if these cycles do occur, they are still natural processes, governed by natural laws. If our impact was to make the hot times hotter, and the cold times milder, would this not still be global warming created by humans?

If this turns out to be the case, does anyone think this would be acceptable? If not, do you think we might do something more than just wait and see what happens?

I'm not asking for the world to change tomorrow. Just please stop supporting those who are hindering progress towards other energy sources. We all know who owns the majority of alternative energy patents, don't we?

 

[Fondueset]

I would have the government arrange things in such a way as to be maximally conducive to my freediving. I believe this single organizing principal will serve the highest possible good of all creatures.

Pete - are you familiar with Neil Young's song 'Piece of crap'?

Thanks Spaghetti; you are right! - I'll work on the pronunciation so I can shout it effectively

 

[roy_nexus_6]

Unirdna, I see nothing wrong with finding alternative energy sources, and I think this can be done without the "Global Warming" fearmongering.
The conspiracy theories about the "evil corporations" holding back the "alternative energy patents" don't help eather.

Fact is, if someone could develop a REAL way of generating cheap energy without burning fossil fuels, this technology would rip through the world like a wildfire. Yes, the power of the free-market.

So far all I have seen is a mix of conspiracy theories implicating evil corporations and "technologies" that violate the laws of thermodynamics. We gotta be able to do better then that.

 

[roy_nexus_6]

I'll stick my neck out:
The most important thing for us to do is: Don't Buy Crap.
.

Laminar, couldn't agree more with your "Don't Buy Crap" statement (in more then one way).

However I must say I prefer the alien dimensional time shift theory by Fondueset to your returning to ice age / neocon-incubator solution. No offence.

 

[laminar]

Beautiful photo, Fondueset.

RoyNexus, Buying Crap that people say (that's the alternate reading you mean, right?) is a pointless game whether it's you, me, Paul Kotik or Fondueset. In my opinion (watch me contradict myself in real time!), crap comes from fear. I'm afraid of having a dirty, hot and dangerous world, a world that is devoid of healthy marine life, clear air and clean water. So if I tend to believe in Global Warming on 6 days out of 10, that's why. Fear.

What I often wonder is what the opponents of the GW idea are afraid of? What are you afraid of? (I have many assumptions on this, but would like to hear it from the horse's mouth - no offence intended). Being wrong (we are all wrong)? Changing a lifestyle in a major way (that's going to happen in the next 50 years whether we like it or not as we run out of oil)? What is it?

 

[Jon]

"Don't Buy Crap"


This goes off into a whole other catagory, or does it?, but there's a great book out there called Affluenza that goes into this a bit. Boiling it down to the point that it is better a to buy a few high quality items that will last vs. a bunch of cheap crap that will fall apart in a couple of weeks and end up in a land fill.


I have heard that one of the great recycling efforts to occur as of late, and which has cut into the "crap" segment and replaced it with longer lasting goods, is actually EBAY. It seems that people are more willing to spend a higher amount of money on a quality product that they will only use for a limited time period, like a baby stroller, if they know they can recoup a large part of that initial investment off of EBAY at a later date. Not the original intention of that website, but a positive spin-off from it.

On the downside, I have heard of at least one dive store closing it's doors, they claimed, because scuba gear is built SO well and lasts SO long that their customer were picking up everything off of EBAY at prices they couldn't compete with.

Jon