Pneumatic speargun without piston

[tromic]

Here is the patent diagram showing the sear tooth operation. The plug or spear tail cap looks longer here than in the above schematic for the gun.View attachment 37440

Interesting and very simple trigger mechanism! However the shaft might bend more easily, similar to front tied "free shaft" with hole through the shaft.

 

[popgun pete]

Here is a photo of the "AMATIKA" speargun from the web-site. Rather heavy for its small size, it uses a front tied spear. Careless muzzle loading could bend these front notched spears, but the material from which the spear is manufactured will be a factor in resisting that.

 

[Jegwan]

It's a short gun, but they claim that it can shoot 6m. Efficiency to be 90%. Impressive.
Peter; with regards to your statement regarding pulling the trigger when loading - is that necessary on the old muzzle trigger guns like the Nemrod Torpedero and its eastern cousin RPO-2?
Jégwan

 

[Vlanik]

It's a short gun, but they claim that it can shoot 6m. Efficiency to be 90%. Impressive.
Peter; with regards to your statement regarding pulling the trigger when loading - is that necessary on the old muzzle trigger guns like the Nemrod Torpedero and its eastern cousin RPO-2?
Jégwan

Они врут...Из Аматики во время тестов не смогли попасть и пробить мишень ...
Вот результаты тестов проводимых в Москве...
They tell lies...From Amatiki during test have not been able to get and overpunch the dartboard...
Here is results test conducted in Moscow...

 

[Jegwan]

Thanks Vlanic,

So the test showed that it can only shoot 2m? Do I understand your test results correct?
Is the "cm" stated the penetration and can you translate what the columns, "0", "1" and "2" mean in your table?

Таким образом, тест показал, что он может только снимать 2m? Правильно ли я понял ваши результаты испытаний правильно?
Является ли "см", заявил проникновение и можете ли вы перевести то, что столбцы, "0", "1" и "2" означает, в таблице?

Jégwan

 

[Vlanik]

0 - не попал
1 - попал, но не пробил
2 - попал и пробил с выходом флажков
Омер темпест 70 - 7 баллов
Аирбалет 80 - 5 баллов
Вланик 60 - 10 баллов
Аматика 47 - 1 бал на дистанции 2 метра

0 - has not got
1 - has got, but has not overpunched
2 - has got and has overpunched with output small flag
Omer Tempest 70 - 7 баллов
Airbalet 80 - 5 баллов
Vlanik 60 - 10 баллов
Amatika 47 - 1 ball on distances 2 metres

 

[Jegwan]

Many thanks. Very interesting.

Большое спасибо. Очень интересно.

Результаты для вашего Вланик удивительны.

Jégwan

 

[tromic]

I suppose that test was not very good.
I believe Tempest had 8 mm spear, Airbalete 7 mm, Vlanik 9 mm, Amatika ?... but was the shortest on test (but only on 2 m..)
Tempest on 3 m - 0; on 4 m - 1 ?? Similar for Airbalete. Something was wrong!

Я полагаю, что тест был не очень хорош.
Я считаю, Буря была 8 мм копье, Airbalete 7 мм, Vlanik 9 мм, Amatika? ... но был самый короткий на тесте (но только на 2 м. ..)
Буря на 3 м - 0; 4 м - 1? Похожие на Airbalete. Что-то было не так!

 

[Vlanik]

Many thanks. Very interesting.

Большое спасибо. Очень интересно.

Результаты для вашего Вланик удивительны.

Jégwan

Я на тестах не присутствовал...
Вот подробный отчёт о проведённых тестах...

...---"
SOOBSCHENIEDOBAVLENO: Pn Fev 15, 2010 7:07 pm Headline of the message: Answer with quoting
For test I have prepared the harpoon similar on length and привязке my harpoon on вланике - 76 refer to and 8 mms by calibre. And there and there used rather thick cord 2,5 mms and pseudo back привязку in both events. I.e. привязка anteroom goes on slitherring bushing, but further forked линь moves over to single through обжимный кримпт for арбалетной of the fishung line. Privyazka is got completely symmetrical and allows exactly to shoot on greater distances. The Difference, only in that that on selected harpoon stood the навинченный trihedral ferrule. On harpoon вланика (either as beside аматики) on three galley proofs was заточено only edge of the harpoon. Partly difference in sharpening was compensated that that itself winding ferrule was more diameter, than unadulterated harpoons вланика and аматики. Hvostovik harpoon was replaced on 8-mi милимитровый from айрбалета заподлицо with harpoon. Thereby he approached on boarding хвостовика and length on 80-y айрбалетт and on 70-y темпест (both handguns apropos new).
To was absent люфт harpoon in надульнике beside темпеста was вклеена plastic bushing by internal diameter 8,3 mms (on that place where is inserted metallic puck бегунка). Beside айрбалета I вклеивать nothing do not become since this harpoon of the ithaca by diameter more staff, and indeed in vain.. Lyuft small all-is was. Sooner whole there output diameter beside 9 mms (this possible and has influenced upon bad accuracy of his(its) shooting, particularly with 4 metres).
The Dartboard presented itself convolute in 4 turns tourist small rug, to which with two sides were VWVput on plastic bottles from under kvass.
One word harpoon to was necessary overpunch the shell most bottles and else 8 layers фальгированого on the one hand tourist small rug.
The Dartboard was got very interesting! When I her(its) has done, me was even shown first that her(its) in general nothing will not be able to overpunch!! ?
Such dartboard имитирует on density of the good carp on 8-10 kg.
Zakachka all ружий was 22 kg. When her(its) standard then with айрбалетом and влаником all were at most exactly, but here is with темпестом happened to a little повозиться i.e. caught the moment, look at power of the flyback etc. The Word on темпест зарядное effort was 22 kgs plus-minus 1 kgs
I have took with you sheet of the thick paper and pencil to was not a divorce if will get water. He was to change in protocol test.
Main problem of the test was check two main belongings:
1. Can- handgun to fall into dartboard drawn near to real fish.
2. Can- it provide the harpoon an energy sufficient to overpunch the good трофей from such distances.
Must was be made 3 пристрелочных of the shot, on each distances whereupon already went five зачетных shot. If harpoon did not fall into dartboard, - that in table was written estimation 0 if harpoon fell into dartboard, but small flag did not leave on the other hand, - was fixed 1 (parenthetically I marked approximite, in centimetre, value, on which left on the other hand tip of the harpoon if he left certainly) if harpoon fell into dartboard and small flag left on the other hand, that was put estimation 2 .
The First on test will go tempest-70. Shall Honestly say, me much liked, what this handgun shot, including his(its) эргономика and handle.. With three metres 4 hits from 5, but with four metres 3 hits. With three metre distances tip harpoon, as a rule left on vapour(pair) refer to on the other hand, with the exclusion of one times, when has got exactly on the centre dartboard. With four metre distances harpoon was stuck before flag.
All-is seen was that ferrule has very high penetrating ability, but for темпеста закачка 22 kgs, simply nursery! If- she was is 30 kgs, that sewed- with three metres dartboard is required!!!
As a whole, on quality of the work with handgun to only positive emotions, - all safely, not very loud shot, harpoon is clearly fixed during charging (metallic щелчек is well heard), comprehensible, clear lowering, suitable fuze. Simply pleasantly keep in hand qualitative and it is correct working thing!
While I felt темпест, - parallel have begun zeroing in Amatiki and беспоршневку of the Sheatfish.
The Second I have taken айрбалетт. As a whole much противоречивостей formed on ружью. Negative more. The Result: with 3 metres, - 3 hits moreover one with opening flag (has got not in most centre dartboard, but approximately on quarter of the diameter from edge). With 4 metres has got only 1 once, all rest harpoon mildly left aside moreover greatly (beside 10-15 refer to). The Evacuation occurred, both on горизонтали, and on вертикали (sooner whole told quite small люфт in надульнике).
The Positive quality, - little more пробойные characteristic, than beside темпеста (the tip left on 4-5 refer to on the other hand, at shooting on 3 metre distances).
The Negative quality, - several times (once seven probably harpoon not долетал before dartboard since the third whorl линя remained on линесбрасывателе), beside I stood the spool on handgun, but advisable see else put the shock absorber that he threw all rest whorl линя. The Shots, when this happened, were перестрелены.
Itself линесбрасыватель so wretched that even in fine 3 mms перчаточках I every time recalled whose-that ma while tried there to place these most three whorls 2,5 mms of the cord.
Floatability with 8 mms by harpoon beside айрбалетте became noticeably negative i.e. will be in realities needs dop. bob that hand not ustavala..
Beside spools защелкнутую рукоятку to pull out not so simply (I all ногти отдавил) well that is there provided regulation and possible фиксацию weaken, but again таки if this will be толстые gloves, that ..
Frontal beside айрбалетта cost(stand)s plastic pipe, in which was VWVpass through rather thick 2,5 mms cord, so here is this cord when whorl remained on линесбрасывателе for several happened jerk already began her(its) cut (could- uzh metallic bushing to insert..).
During charging is absent the clear snub and hereto it is necessary to get accustomed, harpoon abuts against in whispered and his(its) else small effort it is necessary see zakryti..
Now on three беспоршневым handgun, participating in test:
Amatika turned out to be with short rule, but even and with 2 metres tester was in a complicated way from it in dartboard to get (constantly высило). If got, that tip of the harpoon on several refer to passed outward on the other hand dartboard, but with полутора metre once, even passed through small flag. The Shot аматики неплох! But harpoon after two with half of the metre away aside. Outwardly I did not like displaced aside cock and quality of his(its) fabrication itself somehow do-it-yourself!.. The Tester (Nikolayu) аматика liked, spoke that at shooting gets the pleasure. Shot he much, but at the average from five shots he had approximately one hit with distances 2 metres. At the end test, during charging аматика has done пшик and has ed the air
The Handgun of the Sheatfish in a certain time begin глючить, is seen was bad fixed harpoon. Sergey spoke that lowering tunes in and his(its) it is necessary to adjust, he this tried to do several times, but not always this managed. The Effort of the charging, as judged by that, as during she was bent harpoon, - was obviously more 22 kg. Possible, because of this and lowering with she ceased to manage (but I not shall this confirms категорично, let Sergey I shall correct, when померяет the pressure, before test he power of the charging not замерял, but I with itself scales has not taken, has left the building). NIKOLAYK even made fun of on Sergeem, spoke, him that charging of his(its) handgun powerfully reminds the sex!.. All- groups of ten shot Sheatfish from its handgun has done. Serogey constantly complained that does not see where flies the harpoon and was necessary first shoot at broad and flat dartboard. I have personally noticed that his(its) harpoon did not go on stable path, and his(its) often away in different sides though once I saw the hit of the metre with two, can with two with half. The Shot me not впечатлил. Subiektivno more short аматика shot shriller, but on range so-.
Vlanik ed quite well! All shots were made in whitness of Sergeya and Nikolaya. Their saw and others, in t.ch YUriy El approached, when I shot with 4 metres. All зачетные shots harpoon has fallen into dartboard, but nor reek small flag passed on the other side. Though with 3 metres once вылез, approximately on centimetre. Dempfiruyuschaya puck, which was replaced with metallic on puck from strong plastic arts, coped with series shot during test and will pass the test further. The Sound of the shot became else quiet. On extremely-measure since бортика spoke the shot not audible.
The Conclusion: беспоршневка вланик under 22 kgs закачке (the producer is recommended закачка from 20, before 25 kgs) possesses very good accuracy of the shot, but large трофей with armoured чешуей from it will possible take only in stress, or in tail with three metres. With four metres with it possible to take not powerfully large fish, type of the pike, bream and сазанчиков before 2 kg. Again таки if use more fine линь, possible that пробойность dartboard will increase, but I tried to draw near the situation to more real. I use on real hunt cord not fine, than 2,5 mm. thickness.
Hiccupped:
From protocol test"---...

 

[Vlanik]

I suppose that test was not very good.
I believe Tempest had 8 mm spear, Airbalete 7 mm, Vlanik 9 mm, Amatika ?... but was the shortest on test (but only on 2 m..)
Tempest on 3 m - 0; on 4 m - 1 ?? Similar for Airbalete. Something was wrong!

Я полагаю, что тест был не очень хорош.
Я считаю, Буря была 8 мм копье, Airbalete 7 мм, Vlanik 9 мм, Amatika? ... но был самый короткий на тесте (но только на 2 м. ..)
Буря на 3 м - 0; 4 м - 1? Похожие на Airbalete. Что-то было не так!

http://garpun.spb.ru/forum/viewtopic.php?t=12&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=2280

 

[tromic]

It is very difficiult to me to understand all that long text. But Vlanik gun was the best on test.

 

[Jegwan]

Я на тестах не присутствовал...
Вот подробный отчёт о проведённых тестах...

Yes, I understand. I want one

http://garpun.spb.ru/forum/viewtopic.php?t=12&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=2280

Thanks for the link. I copied the text from the post into google translate. It gave me a more easily understandable translation than the one above. Interesting reading.

Спасибо за ссылку. Я скопировал текст с поста в Google Translate. Это дало мне более легко объяснимо перевод, чем выше. Интересное чтение.

Jégwan

 

[Vlanik]

http://podvoh.ru/ipb/index.php?showtopic=13015&st=1120
Here is else reference...
This bend;incline Vlanik-a

 

[popgun pete]

It's a short gun, but they claim that it can shoot 6m. Efficiency to be 90%. Impressive.
Peter; with regards to your statement regarding pulling the trigger when loading - is that necessary on the old muzzle trigger guns like the Nemrod Torpedero and its eastern cousin RPO-2?
Jégwan

Yes, you do have to pull the trigger on those guns to depress the sear tooth so that the spear tail can pass over the top of the tooth without any effort before you commence pushing the piston back against the compressed air pressure inside the gun. If you press the spear shaft's tail in on an already raised sear tooth then the mechanism leverage works against you that is normally used to make pulling the trigger easier with a high level of force on the spear trying to propel it from the gun. They usually tell you to pull the trigger and insert the shaft in the muzzle in the official instructions supplied with the guns. Once you start pushing on the hand loader then you can release the trigger as the shaft body keeps the tooth depressed until it clicks into the annular notch in the front end of the shaft. On a sealed muzzle gun you don't want the sear tooth to mark the shaft surface, so the tooth requires a smooth top if it drags on the spear as you load it and when you shoot.

 

[Jegwan]

Many thanks for your answer Peter.
I see your point regarding the need for the tooth to have a smooth top if it's on a gun with sealed muzzle.
Jégwan

 

[popgun pete]

Being a short mid-handle gun is what will be affecting the "AMATIKA" speargun's accuracy. Those tests assess the accuracy at hitting a target at increasing shooting distances. I can tell you for sure that a rear handle gun of the same length and piston/spear travel is more accurate than its counterpart with a mid-handle. Another factor in shooting tests is familiarity with shooting the guns, my dive buddy could not hit the side of a barn with my short pneumatic when he borrowed it once, yet he noted that I seemed to hit something with every shot on that same dive. These were not long range shots. The difference was I had been shooting that gun for over a decade while he only put a handful of shots through it and had never used a pneumatic gun before, much less a short one.

Quoting a 6 metre shooting range seems a bit misleading for any short speargun as flight of the shaft and repeatedly hitting a target are two different things, even if the spear can strike with lethal force over that distance.

Check out this article describing tests of speargun accuracy using different guns: http://aquatech1.narod.ru/eng12.html

Here is something to help put speargun shooting accuracy in perspective. Say we shoot over a flight distance from the muzzle of 6 metres or 600 cm. At the target we miss the bull's eye by 8 cm. So what was the aiming angle variation from the target, presuming that the gun shoots with absolute precision and accuracy? We can work that out as the tangent of the angle must equal 8/600 which is 0.0133. Therefore the angle is 0.76 degrees of deviation. Can you adjust your aim that finely? I have pulled off shots like that, but don't expect it to be the norm as some luck must be involved. That is about 3 inches off target (3.15"). At 4 metres shooting range the figures are 8/400 which is 0.02 and an angle of 1.15 degrees which with very careful aiming may be achievable. So one of the biggest influences on shooting accuracy is located behind the handle of the gun. On a mid-handle gun you have less ability to gauge the minute deviations of the muzzle as that muzzle is just that much closer to you than it is on a rear handle speargun of the same length.

 

[tromic]

Being a short mid-handle gun is what will be affecting the "AMATIKA" speargun's accuracy. Those tests assess the accuracy at hitting a target at increasing shooting distances. I can tell you for sure that a rear handle gun of the same length and piston/spear travel is more accurate than its counterpart with a mid-handle.
....

I thought they were testing the power of each gun, not the accuracy. That way, it makes more sense.

 

[Jegwan]

Thanks for your wrap up on shooting accuracy and gun length Peter. I have changed gun with my body and experienced the influence of the man behind the gun- this is also true for longer guns.

The purpose of the test was to test the guns performance with regards to penetration (lager fish) at different distances in order to find the most optimal gun for hunting big carps. A target with a hard shell (layers of plastic bottles) was made for the test. I suppose that this some how includes the guns accuracy - that the gun tested actually hits this target.

The Amatika just didn't hit the target more than once and this from a distance of 2 meters. As I understand the original Russian post, was there some technical problems with the Amatika - and it stated that the loading effort (pressure in the gun) was (to) high. Unfortunately was the loading effort not measured for the Amatika in the test.

Anyway; It would surprise me if a short gun like the Amatika haves a effective shooting range of 6m - and I guess that the test in that respect concludes that it has not. It's a close up shooting gun like any other shorty - shooting at targets more than a couple of meters away with a gun like that can never be recommended.

Jégwan

 

[Vlanik]

Thanks for your wrap up on shooting accuracy and gun length Peter. I have changed gun with my body an experienced the influence of the man behind the gun- this is also true for longer guns.

The purpose of the test was to test the guns performance with regards to penetration (lager fish) at different distances in order to find the most optimal gun for hunting big carps. A target with a hard shell (layers of plastic bottles) was made for the test. I suppose that this some how includes the guns accuracy - that the gun tested actually hits this target.

The Amatika just didn't hit the target more than once and this from a distance of 2 meters. As I understand the original Russian post, was there some technical problems with the Amatika - and it stated that the loading effort (pressure in the gun) was (to) high. Unfortunately was the loading effort not measured for the Amatika in the test.

Anyway; It would surprise me if a short gun like the Amatika haves a effective shooting range of 6m - and I guess that the test in that respect concludes that it has not. It's a close up shooting gun like any other shorty - shooting at targets more than a couple of meters away with a gun like that can never be recommended.

Jégwan

Этот пистолет короче аматики на 9 см...
Его длинна 38 см...
Он широко применяется и в море, и в реках, и в озёрах...
Годится для охоты и на карпов, и на быструю кефаль...
это охота в Сочи, август 2013 года...
---------
This gun shorter аматики on 9 refer to...
His(its) long 38 refer to...
He is broadly used and seaborne, and in river, and in lake...
Is fit for hunt and on carp, and on quick mullet...
this hunt in exude, August 2013...

 

[Jegwan]

Wow Vlanic, you're a sharp shooter. Nice location of the shots on the Mullets. Are they taken in the Black Sea?
We also have Mullets here in Denmark during the summer. It's one of my favorite targets. Strong fish and very tasty.
It's only legal for us to spearfish in the sea - so I have never tried to hunt Carps. I hope I will try that in Ukraine one day.
Love the Photo,
Jégwan

Ничего себе Vlanic, вы отличным стрелком. Хорошее расположение из выстрелов на кефаль. Являются ли они приняты в Черном море?
У нас также есть кефали здесь, в Дании в течение лета. Это один из моих любимых мишеней. Сильный рыба и очень вкусный.
Это единственный легальный для нас Spearfish в море - так что я никогда не пробовал охотиться карпов. Я надеюсь, я постараюсь, что в Украине один день.
Любовь Фото,
Jégwan