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Rob Allen guns????

Thread Status: Hello , There was no answer in this thread for more than 60 days.
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I

ivan

looking for deeper water
Jan 26, 2002
1,503
48
0
whats with Iya

hi

Unless im pissed was Iya kinda supporting rob allens in his first post.

cheers
 
I

Iyadiver

Mr. Long Post
Apr 22, 2002
998
74
0
Just teasing Heebes, Ivan...... just teasing. This is the fun part of the forum, once you mention RA or a Riffe, the thread get very long and exiciting....... he he he:D :D

With all the endorsement for RA ( except the unreliable trigger at high band loading ), I am sure it is a deadly gun. However personaly, its power is quite over rated after I seen the Active Eye video production which exclusively uses RA ( single band ) for reef work. The video is great gear tester for non RA owners caused it uses two angle shots. One using a camera on the hunter head and the other a wide angle by a second diver.

On the video it is obvious at the range they shoot the fishes, you can measure by the speargun length they use and what kind of penetration they get. Typical shots conducted due to good stalking skill and "friendly" fishes are averagely only one gun length at most and none of the spear when thru till he shooting line, this is simple to say that penetration power is just decent, unlike how some people been telling us.

The Aussie freedivers that do my Indian Ocean pinacle too do not use their RA even they own one, they prefer something with more punch for the pelagics at this pinacle. In Australia or SA, fishes are plenty, unlike here. Here they been over bombed, over fished, over cynided and so on. It is so obvious that Aussies are probably the second biggest follower of RA guns next to SA guys.

It is easy to imagine what a good spearing spot is like than to actualy experience the reverse.

So don't get pissed just yet me boy.......:D :D I too want an RA. but will wait till the trigger unit get beefed up.
 
Murat

Murat

Promethian
Jun 21, 2002
2,982
159
0
39
Hey IYA, why you ain't buy one trigger mech and handle that design for Wong Hawaiian arbalet, then substitute it to RA.. very coolll:cool:
 
I

Iyadiver

Mr. Long Post
Apr 22, 2002
998
74
0
YES Murat, I thought about that as a LAST option but it might not be as easy as I want it to be. Trigger unit define the kind of shaft u will use cause of the sear. Pipe diameter also maybe different and I will get wobbling if not proper. Precision fit is a must cause trigger sear only hold like 3-4mm of the spear sear...dangerous.

Besides if I buy RA and use a Wong pistol grip with its trigger, is my unit then be called Rob Wong or Allen Wong ??:D :D

Buying a gun and needing to beef up its component (especialy sensitive item like a trigger ) from another gun builder is a pure insult. This is how I see it, not very kind to RA. The gun will then loose identity and when I do well using it ( mmhhhmmm, I wish ), I can't then say that RA is the gun. I take pride in the gun I use, so let me wait a bit longer. They will do something about the trigger, it is only the logical thing to do.

Not that I will load it with purely 20mm x 2, maybe I can't even load a single 20mm.. :confused: but all I want is a safety factor.
I want to load a trigger no higher than 60% of its rated capacity. U know my itchy fingers love to experiment with a gun all the time. The last thing I want is to accidentaly shoot my friend who owns the boat I go on, he is my ticket to my Indian Ocean pinacles in comfort and style and my best buddy,client and partner in crime...oopss I mean SIN.

The talk of Omer and RA is just too tempting, I must have those guns cause they are still affordable, unlike Alexander masterpiece. They can always get hang on the wall if costruction quality is worth it and if me don't like using them. If I do not like every aspect of it, I can always give them to my friend's boat crew or the island boys, like the Picasso and TechniSub I had.
It is very difficult to see a gun quality unless u hold one in your lap and use them. Blown up photos do not tell any real stories.
Just like woman, you won't know them well enough till you "marry" them....Wha ha ha ha.

There is one boat owner I know who have at least 10 Riffes but he doesn't shoot any, he just like displaying it on his walls. Must wait till he decided he want to hang something else......& sell them dirt cheap... to.......me..... :eek:
 
Shadowkiller

Shadowkiller

Digital Hunter
Jul 30, 2002
1,272
267
0
44
Iya,
Honest dude, unless youre after big Yellowfin or Marlin a RA will do the job with a 20mm rubber. Sure it won't shoot out to 7m like your MetalTech but that 20mm rubber sure does have a lot of power. I have no hesitaion in lining up large fish with it.

Maybe if you join Dogmatrix and myself at Papua New Guinea sometime next year (Easter most likely) you can have a go of mine!;)
 
I

Iyadiver

Mr. Long Post
Apr 22, 2002
998
74
0
Shadow,

I know u love RA, no offence intended my friend. Papua and Australia is still a fish heaven. I been to Irian Jaya (north up )which is the other half of that big island that belongs to Indonesia. You can't compare a fish location where fishes are abundant and seldom shot at, to a place like mine where seeing 1 spanish mackerel per 20 minutes of tank dive is already a happy moment. Even that doggie party I last had was an extremely lucky event according to the freedivers who frequent the pinacles.

My Riffe number #2 at 124cm can shoot 7mm Hawaiian shaft. I like using 3 x 14mm bands on it. Don't tell me it will not outshoot a 130cm RA with 1 x 20mm ? The logic is simple. RA supposedly do +- 65kg band pull and I am doing +-120kg. Yet I find my #2 power too mild because I have a #4 to compare.

I have all the MINUS factors bothering me. I don't have as much fishes as in ur good locations. I am noisy with tanks ( I can still get decently close to fishes ). I need 125 nautical miles or 5 hours ride to get to my pinacle which in my standard it is awesome, and in ur (many of u ) standard it is just as ordinary as any close by productive rocks in Australia. I am also not as agile as a freediver, man I need to carry 25kg of gear on me.

This is why my choice of guns is as short as would like them to be or maximum length at 155cm, no longer. Must shoot as powerful as I can take the recoil without effecting accuracy. It cost me great preparation, not to mention lots of money to be at the pinacle and can not go there as often as I would like. I spent a total of 7 tanks dive on my last trip or maybe a total of 140 minutes at average 80 feet. I only managed to pull the trigger 6 times. That is an average of 23 minutes per shot. If you translate that to a good freediver effort , 23 min underwater at 80 feet is about 1 hour of overall freediving effort. Won't you fall asleep if you only get to pull a trigger only once per every hour of freediving ? Yet, I am not pulling the trigger for a Tuna, it is only a sub 10kg Spanish Mackerel.......sad isn't it.

Can you imagine how poor the location I call "heaven" to many of lucky you ??

My concept of hunting is to shoot as far away as possible, not as close as possible. People take pride in stalking skill, I take pride in long range accuracy. It is not easy to shoot far, believe me.
With my noise level being a bubble blower, any fish which wants to get close to me is either curious or stupid, that's it. If I wait for them to get real close, probably I will never get to pull my trigger and be fruitless. I know my breath hold capability and thus I choose scuba and around the pinacle the fishes start to be "available" at 80 feet and deeper. On that last trip, all of the 3 freedivers got nothing...zero.... cause they are probably only 70-80 footer diver.

Also I prefer Ice Pick because I do not use reel or float, thus 7mm shaft is not suitable for a heavy Ice Pick. I am being towed all around by fishes, I need the best spearhead to grip and Ice Pick been the best I tested. My group have snapped clean (not by rocks or cuts ) 400 pound mono shooting line and 450 pound dacron insert in the 5" bungie. Imagine the raw power of the fishes I need to endure. If I use any gun with poor shooting line anchoring system on the muzzle or barrel, the gun will break apart when pulled by the fish. The gun I use must be able to withstand better than 500lbs of pull on its anchoring system, which is the breaking strain of my cable shooting line. Not that I can actualy hold an equivalent of 500 lbs pull force, but I have snapped so many kind of lines. Lines may be tested as 400 lbs but when the tug occured ultra fast, maybe at 300 lbs it will snap.
For this very reason I do not have preference for a Euro gun because many uses plastic muzzle secured by two small screws thru the barrel, and that muzzle is where the anchor is.

There was a friend's XHD JBL muzzle being ripped off the barrel once by a mere 20 kg fish. On scuba with no float and no reel, a gun take real abuse. I find it fair that since I use scuba, I need not reel or floats. A freediver personal fights with a fish in most cases ends with the pull of the trigger. The float do the rest of the fighting. No fins or powerful kicking legs can generate lift greater than 15-20kg in my opinion. This too can only last for only less than 30 seconds. For me a scuba guy, my fight start when I pull the trigger, I am talking of fishes above 10kg.

See, my preference for a particular gun is not about them being higher priced or specific brand. I rather spend less money on guns and more on the trip, if I can. I need a tank-built quality in a gun.
 
I

ivan

looking for deeper water
Jan 26, 2002
1,503
48
0
hi IYA

hi

Just got back from a session of costal spearfishing, I shot a 30lb Spanish Mackeral in 25ft vis with my single band RA 110 I have shot all my biggest fish from 30 to 73lbs with this little baby. However I do agree with you the range isnt all that great, out at the reef I have missed chances where the spear drops short due poor range on my 110 on big doggies, im sure I could get those doggies using my Uncles 4 band Collins Bluewater but hey my stalking is getting hell good. Only problem is every dive im always pushing it waiting on the bottom for that 80lb Spanish Mack to swim past and by the end of the day I have a migrane headache. Just like I do right now after diving all day.

Iya I do agree with you about the range of these guns however as long as it is bringing me Mackeral im happy.

cheers
 
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Amphibious

Amphibious

Working Class Spearo
Mar 17, 2002
2,775
300
0
41
I used to get those headaches a lot before conditioning sets in - a few minutes hitting the O2 bottle on the boatride home usually got rid ofit completly
 
shaneshac

shaneshac

FIN TRASHER
Oct 8, 2002
1,874
178
153
46
RA dealer

Are there any RA dealers in Europe?
If not where do I get one from? Can I get one sent by mail?

Thanks
 
Shadowkiller

Shadowkiller

Digital Hunter
Jul 30, 2002
1,272
267
0
44
hehe Iya,:D
I meant that your Riffe cannons can outrange my RA no probs. Having a riffe myself I know their capacity for extra bands.. Iya: any chance of you ever making it to Australia? I know plenty of guys (Loopy, Dogmatrix, Matt, myself) who'd love to dive with you.

I still back my RA's to take fish in any conditions. Unlike the timber guns a RA is a snipers weapon. Slightly shorter range but oh so quiet! I love crawling along the reef floor sneaking up on 30-40cm fish (Luderick, Mowies etc) and aiming just behind the eye when the fish are 3-4m away from the speartip. Sure I miss sometimes but the sheer smoothness (sorry to hijack your catchphrase Sven) of the RA's shooting is a joy in itself. My percentage of spine or brain shots has increased immensely since I got my 110. Best of all my confidence in the gun makes it easier to stalk fish without the need for desperate shots.

Of course if Im ever lucky enough to go after big tunnys I will be packing a 4 band Riffe for sure. Horses for courses!
And I'll definitely question Iya on how best to set it up!:)
 
I

Iyadiver

Mr. Long Post
Apr 22, 2002
998
74
0
Hi IVAN,

Just got back from a session of costal spearfishing, I shot a 30lb Spanish Mackeral in 25ft vis with my single band RA 110

Jesus..... Ivan, if that is coastal, I can only imagine what is out there in the blue water.:p ...........lucky you.


It is funny, I have only shot 4 doggies, 3 being landed. Two on my pneumatic (under 5kg ) and the last one on #4 Baja. I think dooggies are not difficult to approach, they seems not to swim away from their path. The biggest doggie I seen U/W is only +- 30kg but it was 6 meters away and I was using a JBL, so I dare not shoot, it was out of range. I had a tear off in Bali once from a 15 kg doggie, the viz was 100 footer so I get stupid as usual. It was on a 3 band borrowed Riffe Hawaiian. Luckily my friend with a JBL waited at the right depth and he got a +- 13 kg Doggie. He was almost drag to the sloping depth and all he could do was grab a rock, my other friend helped by doing a 2nd shot, also on his JBL and managed to secure the Doggie.

Whatever get the job done in ur particular environment is the gun to use.

I drool to hear ur stories...... If I ever seen an 80 lbs mack and shoot one, it might be the day I loose my speargun by it, unless I stoned it.





Hi Shadow,
I know how a Euro shaped gun swing, very nice. That is why I said RA and Omer is in my wish list.

Me getting to Aussie is not any soon. With my lousy freediving skill, I consider what Abri calls : A Bobber...wha ha ha ha. A surface float. I'll probably be your caddy stringing all the fishes...:D :D If my job ever get me to go to Aussie, will make sure to group up with you lovely boys. At least we can talk nonsense together....ha ha ha.... my speciality.
 
I

ivan

looking for deeper water
Jan 26, 2002
1,503
48
0
hi

Iya yeah the life on the Outer GBR is pretty mad although the main problem is trying to land your fish before sharks do. Unless you stone your fish there is a very high chance of the $#%& sharks taking our fish, happens regularly. I find Spanish Mackeral extremely inqusitive and easy to approach, yet Doggies well there usually to damn deep for me about 80ft plus. You have better experience with doggies than me cause your already down there on scuba when they approach lucky you.

Whilst I attempt to dive 80ft with a racing heart after those elusive doggies swim past. My dad takes us to our regular pelagic spot where we get our good fish in heeps of current. But lately there seems to be a resident 14ft tiger roaming around I wish he would %^^%& off.

Iya you had any experience with the Collins Bluewater my Uncle has one with an Alexander Slip tip he seems very happy with it. It is a bloody canon any fish in its path is a goner when that big shaft hits em. I still out fish him pelagic wise though.

Its weird my dad has been spearin for 32years and he is hell good at the reef species, but I outfish him for pelagics. My problem with big reef fish is they snag my gun and spear deep down in the coral, and I risk blackout trying to free the fish and gear.

cheers

Ps anyone got any tips for me to get a Cobia still cant get one.
 
Abriapnea

Abriapnea

New Member
Jan 16, 2002
678
43
0
59
Hey Andrew , for cobia just keep eyeballing any whalesharks that you find .;)
 
I

Iyadiver

Mr. Long Post
Apr 22, 2002
998
74
0
Ivan,

I somehow do not like the Collins because the trapezium shape of the stock feels funny when tracking. My friend has a stand by Collins at all time in his boat. It is a rear handle 110-120cm with 3 bands, 7mm Hawaiian shaft tri cut. I swapped the shaft to a Riffe 8mm with Ice Pick and 500 lbs cable. I use cable exclusively. It is muzzle heavy and tiring on long dive. If I swap back to 7mm shaft, I am sure it feel better, but my friend only shoot with Ice Pick and no other. We almost never shoot reef fishes anymore so always Ice Pick is OK. The 3 bands on it feel too easy too load, power is not as good as my #2 Riffe. I use my #2 Riffe distance-estimation once with it and it bounced out off the fish. That's it, no more test.

The trigger & grip is Alexander, very nice. I find the attachment where we cross the shooting line over the shaft to lock it in place being a bit too small, not suitable for cable. 500 ss cated cable keep slipping. The anchor point for the shooting line is straight, another design not suitable for cable. The cable often comes off too. The Riffe one comes at about 60 degrees angle so it catch the cable well. The rubber butt is too simple, in fact ugly.

I seen a blue water Collins but never try it. The one I saw is custom made with 10mm shaft and eclosed track. The other is open track with 8mm shaft about 155cm stock length. Both mid handle. Next time I'll borrow the 155cm, the Blue Water one, me surely can't load. I'll tell you how it shoot.

At one stage I almost wanted to get one of their enclosed track unit but that try on the small one make me think other wise cause I will surely order a rear handle.

You must try my fully rigged #4 Baja. It is very nice to use given the big size.

Look around at big rays, Cobia might be on the tail too.

C-U
 
shaneshac

shaneshac

FIN TRASHER
Oct 8, 2002
1,874
178
153
46
RA dealer

Sorry I have to repeat myself but where can I buy a RA in europe. If not do they mail order.

How much would a 110 with 20mm bands cost?

Thanks
 
I

ivan

looking for deeper water
Jan 26, 2002
1,503
48
0
hi

Sorry man don't know about your RA dealer

Abri yeah I heard they hang around big things like sharks Mantas etc. But problem is I don't see Whale Sharks often.

Iya your sure know your stuff about guns man, all the stuff you mentioned I probably wouldn't even had noticed.

cheers

ps I might be going costal diving again tomorrow
 
H

Hamrrhed

Blue Water Wanna Be
Mar 27, 2001
125
7
0
49
RA Dealer

Shaneshac,
Florida Freediver's mail order, here,s their website Floridafreedivers.net
They have good customer service.
Good luck
Anthony
Tampa FL
 
freediver7

freediver7

New Member
Jun 9, 2004
127
13
0
54
Rob Allen guns are simple, powerful, easy to maintain, and relatively inexpensive. The shafts are tuff. I shot my Rob Allen 120CM point blank in to the rocks with no major effect to the shaft. The draw back is his shafts snap at the notch. however the shafts are only $20 each which is much less than a new Riffe shaft.
 
Last edited:
X

x-frog

New Member
Sep 19, 2004
45
5
0
freediver7 said:
however the shafts are only $20 each which is much less than a new Riffe shaft.

Where you can get RA shaft for $20??
 
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Reactions: freediver7
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