COVID, freediving and vaccination

[Schloggie]

I had CoVID a year ago. I'm 53, recovered quickly. Getting the vaccine should be an informed personal decision IMO, but realize you are the test subject if you get it.

 

[J Campbell]

Scott, covid-19 has indeed been isolated, and it's genome has been sequenced. Why do you think otherwise? Where do you get your information?

 

[scott11]

Everyone - please keep this thread civil and friendly. It is being closely monitored. Everyone is entitled to opinions but you also have to show respect for those with differing opinions.

Has it not been civil and Friendly?

Good to know your closely monitoring.

 

[scott11]

Scott, covid-19 has indeed been isolated, and it's genome has been sequenced. Why do you think otherwise? Where do you get your information?

Do you get your information from Reuters and AP? Who owns them?

 

[scott11]

I had CoVID a year ago. I'm 53, recovered quickly. Getting the vaccine should be an informed personal decision IMO, but realize you are the test subject if you get it.

I'm glad to here that!

Whats's coming into play now should make people think

 

[scott11]

Good morning,

I work as an ER nurse and received the Pfizer vaccine. With both shots my only side effect was a sore arm at the injection site, quickly relieved with ibuprofen.
My husband has always worked from home (even before the pandemic) and now that’s he’s eligible, received the first shot of the Modern vaccine. He is scheduled to get the second this week. His side effects to the first shot mirrored mine.

The hospital I work for made the vaccine voluntary. I chose to get it not only because I’m exposed at work, but I believe it will soon be that “golden ticket” to travel abroad.

That said, I believe any and all vaccines should be the individual’s choice. Nothing has made me more angry than seeing personal freedoms taken away, and economies ruined. Particularly in poorer countries, starving to death is a far worse fate than potentially being one of the few people who dies from COVID.
I’m concerned that in the future governments will use any disease as an excuse to shut down the world again.

Enough of my soapbox...I got the Covid vaccine just like I get the flu vaccine every year. I also have received the various Hepatitis vaccines, again both due to my increased risk for exposure at work, but also because of where I travel in the world.

We have opinions from both sides of the aisle here, and I am confident you’ll do the right thing for you. Please just realize the consequences, either way, if you receive the vaccine or not.

Hey Yellsback,

I really enjoyed your post and it is everyone's personal decision to get vaccinated.

The "golden ticket "you mentioned is a concern but nothing new. I am older and still have my "Shot Records'which are yellow color" from the time I was an infant.

I live abroad and if you can get a ticket, fly and arrive in say Thailand you have to go into quarantine. Last I heard it was 2 weeks. The quarantine hotel can be $1,000's of USD. Your three week vacation turns out to be only 7 days.

 

[7BDiver]

What is "isolated", it can have many measures in science, this too I am still a little confused or ill informed. I know early on where the skepticism about "isolation" came from and it did have weight, see (https://bpa-pathology.com/covid19-pcr-tests-are-scientifically-meaningless/). As stated in the first four studies claiming "isolation" and using genome sequencing by phylogenetic inference can have significant error but can also be significantly useful in tracing virus origins and strain dissemination. As the article SDC79 posted early on in the discussion "isolation" may be to a better standard presently as this analysis takes considerable time. I do not understand the accuracy or quality of the RNA/DNA sequencing being used presently but I have a suspicion it is still rather limited due to the difficulty in studying the virus. I think we all remember the uproar about PCR testing being positive in bananas and such and that "may" have somewhat stemmed from virus isolation or sequencing errors, hopefully we are beyond that by now

 

[J Campbell]

Do you get your information from Reuters and AP? Who owns them?

I got my info from the Center for Disease Control, a branch of the United States Government. But you didn't answer my original question - which was where do YOU get YOUR information?

 

[scott11]

I get my information from FDA, CDC and many news sources.

Just for clarification there are only three "branches" of government that are defined in the US Constitution and the CDC is not one of them. The CDC is a US government agency.

The CDC is a great source for information. here is their home page concerning the topic.

COVID Data Tracker

CDC’s home for COVID-19 data. Visualizations, graphs, and data in one easy-to-use website.

covid.cdc.gov

Note the graph for SARS-CoV-2 Sequences for the week ending 24 April 2021 there were 28,000 variants in that week alone. I don't feel that is isolating the one that causes COVID 19

 

[J Campbell]

I get my information from FDA, CDC and many news sources.

Just for clarification there are only three "branches" of government that are defined in the US Constitution and the CDC is not one of them. The CDC is a US government agency.

The CDC is a great source for information. here is their home page concerning the topic.

COVID Data Tracker

CDC’s home for COVID-19 data. Visualizations, graphs, and data in one easy-to-use website.

covid.cdc.gov

Note the graph for SARS-CoV-2 Sequences for the week ending 24 April 2021 there were 28,000 variants in that week alone. I don't feel that is isolating the one that causes COVID 19

OK, correction accepted, the CDC is an agency. So, if you are using the CDC, FDA, or "many news sources" (echos of Trump) as your source, show me where they say the virus has NOT been isolated or sequenced. Because I already pointed out to you in a previous message, that the CDC says that the virus HAS been isolated and sequenced.
Sars Cov 2 is the name of the virus itself, and yes, there are many variants. Covid-19 is the name of the disease you get from Sars Cov 2. Any of the Sars Cov 2 variants can give you Covid 19, it does not have to be a particular one. And follow up studies are showing that the vaccines have an effect on several variants. It's hard for science to keep up with all these variants, but they are trying and making progress.
Finally, you said - "I don't feel that is isolating the one that causes COVID 19". Science is not about "what you feel".

 

[scott11]

What is "isolated", it can have many measures in science, this too I am still a little confused or ill informed. I know early on where the skepticism about "isolation" came from and it did have weight, see (https://bpa-pathology.com/covid19-pcr-tests-are-scientifically-meaningless/). As stated in the first four studies claiming "isolation" and using genome sequencing by phylogenetic inference can have significant error but can also be significantly useful in tracing virus origins and strain dissemination. As the article SDC79 posted early on in the discussion "isolation" may be to a better standard presently as this analysis takes considerable time. I do not understand the accuracy or quality of the RNA/DNA sequencing being used presently but I have a suspicion it is still rather limited due to the difficulty in studying the virus. I think we all remember the uproar about PCR testing being positive in bananas and such and that "may" have somewhat stemmed from virus isolation or sequencing errors, hopefully we are beyond that by now

First of all thanks for the paper you linked and I feel everyone should read it.

In the paper they Mention Kary Mullis the creator of the PCR test I mentioned earlier. There are great videos of him on youtube I have watched all I could find of the last 6 months. J Campbell this is another example of where I get my information.

Years back I dove for a week with a mathematician employed by the CDC. We talked extensively and to sum it up he told when isolating a disease they use statistics and probability and just take a shot in the dark.

In one of the Kary Mullis videos I watched he said he invented the PCR test looking for something that didn't exist.

You will find many different spellings for Kary's first name. He was a vey brilliant man and a down to earth guy you can understand. Here is a short 2 minute video where he talks about Dr Fauci.



Isolated is a very broad term. What makes it difficult is they haven't even isolated what isolated means.

 

[7BDiver]

I find that the CDC and FDA at this point in time is kind of a funnel for "safe" generalized information for the public that will see little scrutiny but also will not delve into the alternative scientific studies. This ends up being boring and uninsightful information. One thing I love about diving is that it involves openly daring, thinking and experimenting well beyond the established and conservative knowledge of ourselves. My favorite resource is https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/. In those searchable studies you can find information such as the importance of VD, Zinc, how saline rinse and gargle can reduce viral reproduction in upper respiratory infections by 60% and how all the Covid demographics are a reflection of these things. Many studies relevant to understanding diving performance and physiology are there. You won't find that at the FDA and CDC.

 

[scott11]

I find that the CDC and FDA at this point in time is kind of a funnel for "safe" generalized information for the public that will see little scrutiny but also will not delve into the alternative scientific studies. This ends up being boring and uninsightful information. One thing I love about diving is that it involves openly daring, thinking and experimenting well beyond the established and conservative knowledge of ourselves. My favorite resource is https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/. In those searchable studies you can find information such as the importance of VD, Zinc, how saline rinse and gargle can reduce viral reproduction in upper respiratory infections by 60% and how all the Covid demographics are a reflection of these things. Many studies relevant to understanding diving performance and physiology are there. You won't find that at the FDA and CDC.

Wow that is quite a website! I know what I'm doing the rest of the week. Thanks 7B!

J Campbell I get some of my information from 7BDIVER

 

[J Campbell]

There is talk on the internet about breath holding to prevent C19. Most of these involve very short holds. But as freedivers we know that a really long breath hold will significantly raise the blood levels of CO2. Does this high level of CO2 in our blood outgass to our lungs also? And does CO2 kill or otherwise inhibit Sars Cov 2? Food for thought.

 

[scott11]

OK, correction accepted, the CDC is an agency. So, if you are using the CDC, FDA, or "many news sources" (echos of Trump) as your source, show me where they say the virus has NOT been isolated or sequenced. Because I already pointed out to you in a previous message, that the CDC says that the virus HAS been isolated and sequenced.
Sars Cov 2 is the name of the virus itself, and yes, there are many variants. Covid-19 is the name of the disease you get from Sars Cov 2. Any of the Sars Cov 2 variants can give you Covid 19, it does not have to be a particular one. And follow up studies are showing that the vaccines have an effect on several variants. It's hard for science to keep up with all these variants, but they are trying and making progress.
Finally, you said - "I don't feel that is isolating the one that causes COVID 19". Science is not about "what you feel".

The civics lesson was my pleasure.

What does "Echoes of Trump" even mean. Why did you Know you needed to add that.

You have not pointed out to me in a previous message that the CDC has fully isolated and sequenced the actual cause the disease. Further you have not provided a link of them even saying that.

I provided a link that shows it is ongoing effort with 28K variants just last week. I know it is not fully isolated because the CDC has not found all the variants.

You do not have to prove to me why you and your wife got the jabs. What variants were in the jabs.

 

[7BDiver]

There is talk on the internet about breath holding to prevent C19. Most of these involve very short holds. But as freedivers we know that a really long breath hold will significantly raise the blood levels of CO2. Does this high level of CO2 in our blood outgass to our lungs also? And does CO2 kill or otherwise inhibit Sars Cov 2? Food for thought.

One must carefully consider the hypoxic vs hyperoxia approach as different viruses will be stimulated to one or the other. This article may be somewhat insightful in that regard https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7385969/. In Breatheology, Stig touches on the importance of NO and its health benefits in antibacterial properties but NO may have a different effect when it comes to viral infections and in many studies is linked to the pathogenesis of the infection https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2327086/. It's a tricky world out there but the information has never been more abundant and accessible!

 

[Mackerel]

Covid? I just dive and dive. I do believe by diving, sea water enters your nostrils thus neutralizing the effects of covid. Seawater is saline,which kills bacterias and viruses. I remember the reply of ensign Gay after being fetched out of water when asked by the M.O. on what he did to his wounds as there were no signs of infection, "Soak it in saltwater for 3 days".
Vit C plus sunshine.

Staggering. Did you vote for Trump by any chance?

 

[Roxton]

This experimental vaccination from frankenstein's laboratory doesn't even come near me.
It's all about money.
I’ don't know anyone who is sick, nobody who has died, but many who suffer from the collateral damage of the lock downs.
But many who were totally paralyzed, frightened by the primitive and mendacious propaganda in the media.
The Covid tests and vaccinations in my country are totally chaotic. Extremely many false positives. Manipulated diagnoses. Hyped death rates.
Manipulation through fear, hystery and misinformation.

I am not participating.
I will not conform.
I dont care.

I live my life normally, go on traveling and diving as soon as possible.

 

[Yellsback]

Staggering. Did you vote for Trump by any chance?

I voted for Trump, both times, and happily would again. That said, I’m not sure what someone’s political affiliation has to do with answering the person’s original question.

I thought this thread was sharing opinions and experiences about whether or not to receive the Covid vaccine - see my earlier reply. I personally don’t appreciate your quip. However, I defend your right to say it. Happy diving everyone!

 

[Mackerel]

I voted for Trump, both times, and happily would again. That said, I’m not sure what someone’s political affiliation has to do with answering the person’s original question.

I thought this thread was sharing opinions and experiences about whether or not to receive the Covid vaccine - see my earlier reply. I personally don’t appreciate your quip. However, I defend your right to say it. Happy diving everyone!

Someone asked for advice about vaccination, and you recommended inhaling salty water. I'm not letting that go past without a remark.