Exhale (FRC) Adaptation

[sebastien murat]

G'day Brett,

How goes it?

Excessive descent speed, hypoventilating and work will invoke the "uglies."

The "uglies" should not be experienced whilst doing sub-max serial dives, if one warm-ups, actively, before-hand. An active and specific warm-up should always be performed before any type of serial diving, whether on 'inhale' or 'exhale', otherwise it will lead to a premature use of anaerobic energy stores and fatigue. With 'inhales' there is an increased risk of the "uglies" because of the work involved in having to swiming/haul down. This is experienced as a sudden and seemingly unexplainable shortness of breath early in the dive.

During max dives, it would be probably fool-hardy not to warm-up before 'inhales' as the active swimming descent could further elevate the compression-induced hypercapnia -> CO2 blackout. But active warm-ups are counterproductive to optimal performance.

Personally, I have never experienced this effect during max 'exhales' with no warm-up, but then again I'm not swimming down and I'm 'falling' comparatively slowly.

During disciplines such as 'no-limits', where descents speeds can reach in excess of 3 m/s it is advantagous to hyperventilate, thereby starting with a reduced alveolar/arterial CO2.


29-31 degrees Celcius water temp. is not conducive to max performances. In my case, for example, I notice a significant decrease in performance. Such water temps (probably just lower, once you get gain and generate enough body heat) are on the other hand, ideal for serial diving. I would suggest doing max. perf before doing anything else but these will be hard yakka, no doubt and will affect you subsequent serial diving ability by overly taxing your energy stores. There's no easy way for trying to do both, unfortunately.

The all important criteria is to not override the need to ascend and surface when the urge to breathe arrives. What regime you should follow depends on what your aims are; it really is all very specific. If you are restricted to depth, as you might be around Brisbane, I would suggest fixating the static/descent time to say, 35" (equivalent to 20m depth) and then swimming for longer, still very slowly though. You could shorten recoveries by ~5" per week/fortnight (?), but that would depend on what type of surface conditions you experience. Clearly, if its rough, the last place you want to be is on the surface.

My understanding of morphological modifications of the lungs with exercise/pressure is that the alveolar-capillary wall is reinforced by becoming thicker. This will compromise gas-exchange during high intensity terrestrial exercise. Under pressur, however, gas exchange is probably not greatly affected as there is capillary engorgement so that gas diffusing capacity increases.


Hope this helps?

Seb
Aust

 

[Decca]

Interesting questions Brett.

Sebastian wrote:

An active and specific warm-up should always be performed before any type of serial diving, whether on 'inhale' or 'exhale', otherwise it will lead to a premature use of anaerobic energy stores and fatigue.

Which begs the question, 'What form of warm-up do you suggest"?

 

[sebastien murat]

Not just the form but the duration also.

I wouldfirst suggest a light calisthenic warm-up of dynamic flexibility not longer than 20" and focusing on major muscle groups done 'dry' if water temp. is <27-28 (depending on individual adaptation)....that would be most of us not living in tropical waters. It is not the aim here to attempt to improve flexibility but to elevate peripheral body temperature, since locomotors work most efficiently at a temperature of ~38 degress Celsius.

One should reduce, perhaps even omitt, this 'general' warm-up if a dive session begin later in the day, where body temp. will most likely be elevated anyway, due to circadian rhythms. If the session is done in the evening I would most definitely omitt it.

The specific warm-up should simulate the actual dive pattern that will be undertaken, all but in atenuated form and should not exceed the physiological break point (PBP). All we are doing here is installing or activating the correct movement patterns. If you 'push it' here you'll be thinking about everything but technique. So, in reference to exhales', this would imply shortening respective static & dynamic phases so that one can 'digest' the internal/extrenal information coming in through the senses, yet still remaining submerged until the PBP is reached.

When I refer to specificity, I mean, movement amplitude, contraction speed but not duration. You should be polishing or fine-tuning your style an dtempo to the up-coming session. Typically, would aim for 3-4 reps with full recoveries at no greater than 50-70% of max aerobic intensity or 5-6 reps at 50-70% intensity, with each rep. increasing in duration. The latter of these is, typically, undertaken if one hasn't been diving for some time and may need to do some considerable amount of adjusting of technique to reach an acceptabele degree of movement efficiency.


The specific warm-up should always be done 'wet' and should not take more than about 15-20'.

If you don't have enough time to train I would suggest undertaking training session at lunch-time or late afternoon to do away with the general warm-up.

Also, any stretching to improve flexibility should be done post-training.


Seb

 

[Decca]

Plenty of food for thought here Sebastien. Seems to me that if you were doing dives 50-70 % of 'maximum aerobic intensity'; which I presume refers to physical movement and exertion such as when finning to the surface; you would not be anywhere near your PBP. At the same time you are saying to 'remain submerged till PBP is reached'. Can you clarify this.

Managed to get my ears to 'pop' for the first time no hands in several metres of water yesterday. Hopefully I can improve this in the future.

 

[sebastien murat]

Decca,

WE should distinguish between PBP and maximum aerobic intensity (VO2max).

PBP refers to the urge to breathe or dyspnea and, is due to the build-up of PaCO2, i.e., in the blood. It is a dynamic variable which becomes, typically, protracted by the end of a warm-up. A warm-up makes the duration to onset of PBP longer. Some may find that from the beginning of the warm-up to the end of the warm-up that the duartion to PBP may lengthen considerably, others not, depending on many variables of which peripheral vasodilation is central.

Maximum aerobic intensity (=VO2max). At this point muscles will be running anaerobic, i.e., with significant blood lactate accumulation. It does not mean, however, that aerobic stores are not contributing. In my experience 50-70% VO2 max. depending on the diver, their fitness and experience corresponds to the onset of the PBP. In serial diving, the aim is to ensure that lactate, from anaerobic energy sources, is metabolized as quickly as it accumulates, otherwise fatigue will set-in, fast. Lactate accumulation is felt as localized muscle fatigue/'burning' during apnea. Some call this point OBLA (Onset of Blood Lactate Accumulation) which in most adequately trained spearfishers corresponds to ~50%(fit) -70%(elite).

The important thing is to stop at the PBP, for fear of making the muscles tired. The PBP is one's sign to surface (now!) in the pool or to begin the ascent in the ocean. Horizontal and vertical PBP are different and are affected by such things as lung volume and the amount of hydrostatic pressure experienced, for example. Exceeding the PBP will result in protrcated recoveries and a reduced potenial number of total dives that could be achieved without excessive fatigue.

To complicate things even more, hyperventilating will facilitate serial diving warm-ups, but that's another story for another time!

Seb

 

[Decca]

Ah. It all becomes clear. Thanks.

Have been playing around with the suggestions in the pool. Since starting dry warmups, the PBP has increased dramatically. Not sure if it was directly related to the warmups, but it does seem coincidental.

When I did the course I'd get contractions at 30-40 secs during the static phase. Recently I have gone out to a minute with little urge to breathe. I figured at around 45 seconds I was starting to relax, and made that my 'turn around point'. The almost total lack of urge to breathe for such an period has got me wondering what has made the difference.

I have also been doing say 3 to 4 deep breaths about a minute prior to the dive. This was not unlike the breathe up I'd do just prior to an inhale dive. I have also been using hands free equalising exclusively in the pool. These may have made a difference.

 

[Decca]

Went for another dive in a shallow pool recently, about 1 m depth. Just didn't feel right, and was distracted/annoyed by some kids swimming nearby. I seem to attact them like a magnet. I was getting contraction at 30s. For me at least, the psychological factors have a big affect on my PBP.

 

[Alun]

the reason you attract them like a magnet is because they're wondering what that guy is doing holding his breath underwater, and maybe they think it's quite cool or something. don't forget the monkey-see-monkey-do factor when you train in public sessions. the danger is that these kids will copy what you do in the pool, or in their pool or bath at home...

 

[sebastien murat]

Decca,

For sure psychological stress will cut-down the onset to PBP and adversely affect serial diving capacity. Psychological stress will, however, improve maximal diving capacity (dynamic or otherwise), but only for those whom not only undertsand, but appreciate its benefits. Only through repeated exposure to such situations can it be appreciated and can one gain the most out of max. sessions.

Sometimes, after some time away from the water, it can be all a distant memory and there can be sensory overload in anticipation of what's to come. In such cases, even the most experienced will, presented with enough distress, pull-the-pin on a dive. This is why I opt to "go there" every session, if I can swing it. Sometimes, I have to dig deep, and even then I may be overloaded. Best not to think about it too much and just tell yourself "how sad, too bad for me" and simply let it go and move on.

Seb

Seb

 

[Decca]

Alun,

You're right. Its a bit disconcerting sitting on the bottom wondering when someone is going to jump on you. Probably very good psychological training. Also teaches you patience. :duh

Sebastien,
Seems to me that the PBP is subjective, ie. largely dependent on how you feel, rather than on how close you actually are to you limit of oxygen. Even contractions, for me at least, are triggered by subjective factors it seems, rather than objective ones. About the only objective indicator I have to go by is the time.

What we need is an oxygen sensor that can be worn while diving. :hmm

 

[The Exhale Diver]

How does psychological stress reduce ones ability to serial dive, is it purely to do with an increased heart rate? and then conversly how does it help on max dives, is that to do with the bodys ability to slow the heart rate underwater when subjected to stress (the opposite response to on land). I am guessing the reason one could not relay this to serial diving would be due to a slower recovery from a stressed dive.

Am on on the mark here or have I gone off track.

 

[sebastien murat]

Brett,

Psychological stress reduce ones ability to serial dive because it invokes vasoconstriction of blood vessels running to locomotors. Reduced blood flow to working muscles -> anaerobiosis and excesive metabolic waste product accumulation which takes more time to off-load.

Heart-rate is an indirect indicator of th extent of vasoconstriction.

Seb

 

[subaquaticus]

Brett, the diffucult thing about exhale diving/statics is that it is next to impossible to make sure that you are exhaling the same amount of air each time. That's probably why there are no competitions in empty lung statics!
Just experiment with it. But do not exhale too much otherwise your depth will be severely limited because you don't have enough air to compensate.

Hi Haaico,

I was your neighbour at Maison du Séminaire last July and safety diver for one or the two Dutch records you broke (free immersion or constant weight with no fins, I do not remember)...

How are you ?

Are you coming to the CIPA Open ?

See you there

François

 

[cebaztian]

MURAT Clinic

There will be only one Sebastien Murat Clinic in Europe this summer.
In Lysekil on the west coast of Sweden. 12-14 august.
210 euro. Accomodation and local transport will be arranged.
http://www.fridykning.se/arkiv/murat05eng.html

Two more praticipants needed.

regards
SebastiAn
Sweden

 

[cebaztian]

Some conclusions from the MURAT Clinic in Sweden.

http://www.fridykning.se/freediving/features/muratarticle1.html

regards
SebastiAN
Sweden

 

[laminar]

Hi Sebastian,

Awesome article! Really inspiring. Thanks for sharing your experiences. I especially like the last line.

You should submit this article (if you're interested) to Paul Kotik so we can put it on the main site.

18C water sounds ideal for this kind of diving. What kind of a thermocline was there on your no fins dive? In Vancouver, with water between 5C - 14C in the first 20m of depth, I believe the thermocline really augments this effect with no suit.

To Seb Murat: What about cross-training? Those of us who don't have access to open ocean and safety and a pool with spotters on a regular basis need alternate methods to max-rep diving in real conditions.

I'm think about waiting for the dive response (DR), or maybe when talking about land exercises, we should call it the Apnea Response. Take apnea walking/hiking/exercise for example. Following his methods, wouldn't it make sense to hold your breath FRC and sit still until your heart rate drops, THEN start the exercise and try to go as far as possible on each rep? Do a limited number of reps, say 3-5, ie. the number of dives I would expect to do no-suit in colder water before getting too cold.

Pete

 

[cebaztian]

18C water sounds ideal for this kind of diving. What kind of a thermocline was there on your no fins dive?

Actually - this is what realy surprised me. I thought adding 5 meters to a already hard achieved PB would be impossible in swedish waters (19degrees). What I have learnt is that it is the COLD that was part of making it possible. Thermocline changes - maybe at 10-15 meters some drop to maybe 12 degress. No idea. Its dark, its cold and it is crushes in on you. Thats all I know

Sebastian
PS. It was not FRC. It was TLC without packing. I usually pack 30 times.

http://www.fridykning.se/freediving/features/muratarticle1.html

 

[The Exhale Diver]

Hi all,

I thought I would provide an update since I started this thread a while ago now as someone stepping into FRC diving.

Well roughly for the past 9 months now I have trained quite consistently in this technique, in the pool probably about 3 times a week (1 hour sessions) and I would have also averaged maybe 1.5 days a week in the ocean (6 hour sessions).

The pool training has been excellent my times have doubled, after I am warmed up for the serial diving I am able to consistently do a 1:30 - 2:00 minute static followed by a 25 metre swim which takes a further 30 - 35 seconds, all done quite easily with a clear head and with a surface time equal to that of the dive time, I have no idea what my max ability would be as I train conservatively by myself, although that is about to change soon so I will be able to provide some details on my upcomming max attempts which I suspect will not be much better as they are two different worlds.

Interestingly my straight out dynamic ability has not improved that much perhaps that is because I have not focused on that side of it so much or perhaps it is because exhale diving requires a static phase to reap the full benefits of sedated muscles.

In the ocean my progression has been slower largely due to the fact my lungs have never been that small in my entire life before (i.e. I previously have never dived much below 30 metres inhale which is about where I would feel the pressure at the exhale equivilent of 10 - 12 metres) although last weekend I did hit the bottom at 24.7 while hunting on exhale which I am very pleased about. Its a patient game as I claw deeper each time by a metre or so, I am confident In time I will master the technique.

I must say my dive buddies are becomming quite jealous as they have witnessed my growth while they continue to fight with the ocean as they agressively kick down at pace while I casually let gravity take me where I want to go, it truely is a beautiful way to dive and a safe one at that my days of samba's and that dizzy fuzzy head feeling we all know are now a distant memory for me.

I look forward to developing further, better wait until I get over this cold first.

 

[efattah]

Since my recent DCS incident I have permanently switched to FRC dives as well.

I have been training in the ocean about 3 days a week, but only for a couple of weeks. My pattern is usually 2-5 'deep' FRC dives, in the 28-42m range, followed by about 15 reps of horizontal FRC dynamics with fins, followed by about 15 reps of horizontal FRC dynamics without fins.

The first thing that hit me was a profound iron deficiency, which manifested itself as cracked, dry skin on some of my knuckles. (Presumably caused by red blood cell and myoglobin synthesis sucking all the iron out of my blood). Adding 144mg of iron protein succinylate each day prevented the iron deficiency from progressing but did not fix it. I upped my iron intake to 300mg a day and now fingers are going back to normal, plus I feel better in general. Of course I will only continue the iron supplementation as long as necessary. A have a blood analyzer and I will see in a few months if I can reach the 22g/dl of hemoglobin that Sebastian Murat once had.

Even in just two weeks my FRC diving ability has improved dramatically. My FRC dynamic swims have increased from 1'00" (41 strokes) to 1'28" (53 strokes). I am now doing 1'15" FRC static followed by a 50 second dynamic (non-max), although this is more of a test, it is not the way I am currently training horizontal sets. My FRC no-fins swims have increased from 49 seconds (16 strokes) to 1'03" (20 strokes).

My FRC recreational diving time has increased from 1'20" to 1'45" - 1'50", these are all conservative dives with a 6.5mm / 5mm suit configuration. I can do repeated 42m dives on the Ansell wall with 3-4 minute rests in between, rather than than the 6-10 minute rest I would require after full packing.

One strange thing I have noticed is that right when I recover from my no-fins swims, near the end of the session when I am coolest and most blood shifted, I will occasionally experience a profound wave of numbness which engulfs my arms and legs for about 5-6 seconds during my early recovery breathing. This is not the same as the acid burn which sometimes happens during recovery. It is a total numb feeling as if the blood is sucked out of my arms and legs entirely, for a few seconds.

My dives are done on a slightly higher than true FRC volume; I probably start the dive with about 5.5 litres of air, vs. my full inhale volume of 7.5 to 8L, vs. my packing volume of near 11L. In my thick suit (6.5mm / 5mm), I must do two monofin kicks and half an arm stroke to initiate the dive. While sinking I normally do my mouthfill at 12m-14m.

Next year (2006) I will be competing in constant weight doing FRC dives with no wetsuit. I am confident I will reach at least 85m if not 100m. As it stands, equalizing tests have shown that in theory I could only equalize to about 85m on an FRC dive using air, unless I develop some new technique or switch to wet equalizing. However I have some ideas in that area.

The greatest thing I have noticed (and most important) is a DRAMATIC increase in my enjoyment of my dives, both recreational dives and also training sets. It is a profoundly enjoyable way to train; by doing my dynamics in the ocean I can see marine life and I never get bored.

Further, I never experience non-clinical DCS style 'fatigue' after diving; instead I always feel great and have tons of energy. I never realized how often I would get fatigued after inhale dives with packing. Plus, I have done some FRC dive patterns which were worse than the patterns which caused DCS on inhale w/packing, without any effect whatsoever.

There is a beautiful wall near Ansell point which has tons of gigantic sponges to a depth of 60m or more. It was during inhale/packing dives on this wall that I suffered the worst DCS a while ago. My goal is to be able to dive this wall repeatedly (60m reps) on FRC, without suffering any DCS symptoms.

 

[jome]

Eric, how do you plan to equalize to 85m on FRC? Just a normal mouthfill or do you have some other tricks in store? Do you use a mask?

Deepest FRC dive I ever did was 30m with a sphera, and it was the absolute limit in terms of equalizing...

I've been playing with the idea of building a "fluid mask", with similar lenses than the goggles, but which would allow wet equalization in freshwater (filled with saline) plus protect the face from the cold better than goggles...But I guess a mask is moving around so much that the lenses would not work very well...?