Saturday, February 23, 2019
  • Welcome to the DeeperBlue.com Forums, the largest online community dedicated to Freediving, Scuba Diving and Spearfishing. To gain full access to the DeeperBlue.com Forums you must register for a free account. As a registered member you will be able to:

    • Join over 40,000+ fellow diving enthusiasts from around the world on this forum
    • Participate in and browse from over 496,000+ posts.
    • Communicate privately with other divers from around the world.
    • Post your own photos or view from 7,300+ user submitted images.
    • All this and much more...

    You can gain access to all this absolutely free when you register for an account, so sign up today!

Infinitengines "Dreamair" pneumatic speargun

OP
OP
popgun pete

popgun pete

Well-Known Member
Jul 30, 2008
2,645
493
123
Australia
I was just thinking that high speed spinning items can function like a gyroscope which would tend to stabilize the "Dreamair" gun during the shot as the winding drums and axle certainly spin rapidly. Another consideration is that having been spun up to a certain velocity how is their rotational inertia handled in order to bring the spinning assembly to a halt. There does not appear to be a wishbone catcher as such, so that task must fall to the inner cable anchor point which would receive quite a jerk when it pulled up the winding drums and axle assembly to stop them spinning after the shot.
Andreas Zournatzis himself supplied the answer to this query. What happens is at the end of the shot the piston has reached its most rearwards travel in the gun (remember the piston moves forwards when the "Dreamair" gun is being cocked) with the axle and winding drums assembly still spinning. As they continue to rotate they will start to wrap the inner cable in the opposite direction to which it is usually wound on the inner drum, in which case the piston is dragged forwards again against the air pressure in the gun. This serves to brake the spinning assembly as its rotational inertia cannot do much work against the gun's start pressure, hence a form of "pneumatic braking" takes place on the spinning axle and winding drums assembly.
 
Reactions: Diving Gecko
OP
OP
popgun pete

popgun pete

Well-Known Member
Jul 30, 2008
2,645
493
123
Australia
First "Dreamair" model released will be in the most common gun length used for both band powered and pneumatic powered spearguns.
 
OP
OP
popgun pete

popgun pete

Well-Known Member
Jul 30, 2008
2,645
493
123
Australia
The "Dreamair" speargun is a high speed winching device using a closed cycle pneumatic energy storage accumulator to catapult spears at high velocity via a CVT action cable drive system. As such it constitutes a complete revolution in the field of underwater arms for spearfishermen seeking a versatile weapon of wide ranging shooting powers and high levels of accuracy.
 
Reactions: Kodama
OP
OP
popgun pete

popgun pete

Well-Known Member
Jul 30, 2008
2,645
493
123
Australia
"Dreamair" underwater rifle using CVT action cable drive system powered by energy stored in non-consumptive pneumatic accumulator will soon be released to the spearfishing market.
 
Reactions: Kodama
OP
OP
popgun pete

popgun pete

Well-Known Member
Jul 30, 2008
2,645
493
123
Australia
In anticipation I had asked whether a "Dreamair" speargun will fit inside a neoprene "gundom" and the answer is that it does, provided that you remove the reel from the gun. A "gundom" is a zippered speargun cover made from “camo” neoprene wetsuit material and will protect the “Dreamair” gun’s outer winding drums from handling impacts. I use these soft covers as you can roll them up when not in use, unlike a hard shell gun case.

https://spearfishing.com.au/collections/bags-gun-bags/products/adreno-invisi-skin-gundom-gun-sleeve
Adreno GUNDOM R.jpg
 
Last edited:
OP
OP
popgun pete

popgun pete

Well-Known Member
Jul 30, 2008
2,645
493
123
Australia
Soon? Really? As in ‘in or after a SHORT time ‘?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Andreas is finalizing the carbon fiber production methods, so once that is sorted out they can start making them to build up stock. Many parts are required to build any speargun, but the "Dreamair" has a lot more small high detail parts than most other spearguns and they all need to come together at the right time. Just look at the piston shock absorber which uses an oil pump as a damper unit.
 

Kodama

Active Member
Jun 20, 2016
280
93
43
Belgium - California
www.eastwind.be
Andreas is finalizing the carbon fiber production methods, so once that is sorted out they can start making them to build up stock. Many parts are required to build any speargun, but the "Dreamair" has a lot more small high detail parts than most other spearguns and they all need to come together at the right time. Just look at the piston shock absorber which uses an oil pump as a damper unit.
I understand that it takes time to make all these parts but this project is not the greatest example of being on schedule hence my sarcasm. I am Looking forward to the release and appreciate that they are trying to do this properly no matter how long it takes.
But I won’t be holding my breath...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Reactions: Diving Gecko

Diving Gecko

shooter & shooter
Jun 24, 2008
1,214
294
138
Shanghai
I understand that it takes time to make all these parts but this project is not the greatest example of being on schedule hence my sarcasm. I am Looking forward to the release and appreciate that they are trying to do this properly no matter how long it takes.
But I won’t be holding my breath...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I am with Kodama on this one. Forgive me, but seen in the light of a few other false starts, the "Andreas is finalizing the carbon fiber production methods" sentence doesn't actually sound like guns are just around the corner. They could be, and hopefully they are, but I think Andreas is a perfectionist which is why the guns look spectacular - but it also means a lot of stopping and going and I am just worried what other things could creep up and cause setbacks.
Honestly, unless there's almost a guarantee of a very immediate shipping date I, personally, would rather just let the jungle drums be a tad more silent until we actually see these things packed in boxes ready to ship.
I know Pete has all the best intentions and I like to hear the technical updates, but if there's another delay, it would possibly have been better not to even know about it;-).

On another note, a few weeks, back I spent some time with Google translate reading some posts on a Greek forum (likely from a link of Pete's) about this project. Supposedly, a lot of the setbacks/delays also just had to do with what the local spearos, and from memory Andreas, would more or less just call "well, it's Greece...". I think it covered the unstable financial climate there in recent years. I also speculate that Andreas must have a full time job besides this project and he has to work to make money to sustain the DreamAir development and then find the time to actually get the parts designed and made. And then, "well, it's Greece", so supposedly it's been hard to make the money and hard to find partners and manufacturers willing to take it on. At least, that's what, with a certain degree of speculation, I am thinking, could have happened.
 
Last edited:
Reactions: Kodama
OP
OP
popgun pete

popgun pete

Well-Known Member
Jul 30, 2008
2,645
493
123
Australia
I am operating some distance from Greece, but I know quite a lot of changes were made to the guns subsequent to me running a critical eye over where the likely problems would be. Now I don’t suggest that my comments precipitated any changes, but they were about the same time as they would-be discovering them for themselves. I have encountered similar projects before that fell down the same holes, so I knew what to look out for in the field of cable drive spear guns.

The problem has been that after re-engineering the gun my guess is the oval piston idea, which was one of the second tier gun changes, began to not look so good an idea after all. That required a return to the cylindrical bore flanked by two crescent shaped bores and rather than do that in alloy they decided to go to carbon fiber instead. Now the winding drums and axles don't need changing, but the bearing and seal mounting locations do and that I believe is why things have dragged on as problems that had been solved with the alloy guns had to be reconsidered again. The cable drive train was proven the first time around, now they have to get the new carbon fiber "hull" right, note that all this has been deduced by me wearing my "Sherlock Holmes" hat.
 

Diving Gecko

shooter & shooter
Jun 24, 2008
1,214
294
138
Shanghai
It also sounds like they are breaking new ground by using a a CF barrel not just as a reservoir but indeed also as the barrel for the piston. I have no doubt it can be done but off the top of my head I can't think of other examples of it being used as such. So, I reckon they had had to figure out exactly how to lay on the first coat on the mandrel and such.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
OP
OP
popgun pete

popgun pete

Well-Known Member
Jul 30, 2008
2,645
493
123
Australia
Well we will soon find out as a presentation is not far away now and that will come from the "Dreamair" project team. I have ordered an extra "gundom" in anticipation of having a "Dreamair" gun to put in it.
 
Reactions: Kodama
OP
OP
popgun pete

popgun pete

Well-Known Member
Jul 30, 2008
2,645
493
123
Australia
I imagine you must have quite a collection of popguns. Do you get to use most of them on a regular basis?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I have my favourites which I have “my eye in on”, so it is point and shoot and a hit most of the time. Use too many guns and you are master of none. Ditto for firing powers, use too many and your “auto shoot” goes off as your projected flight lines to the target have too many variations to cope with.
 
Reactions: Kodama
OP
OP
popgun pete

popgun pete

Well-Known Member
Jul 30, 2008
2,645
493
123
Australia
Andreas has explained to me that the oval piston will continue in the later alloy version of the "Dreamair". They have had no problems with it after thousands of shots put through the alloy guns. The reason that it was not used in the carbon fiber bodied “Dreamair” was the problem in engineering an oval piston bore in that material, hence the piston will run in a specially treated bore of a cylindrical configuration. So there you have it directly from the source. My concerns about oval bore wear were unfounded as unlike a car engine where the pistons conduct millions of strokes and thus bores and pistons need to be round the relative frequency of strokes in a speargun is many orders of magnitude lower.
 
Last edited:
Reactions: Kodama
OP
OP
popgun pete

popgun pete

Well-Known Member
Jul 30, 2008
2,645
493
123
Australia
Now we just have to wait, but as I mentioned a long time ago the signal that things are moving is that the www.infinitengines.com web-site will come back to life. Very early on it showed the astronaut floating around with a white "Dreamair" in a CGI rendition and a few other dramatic and eye-catching poster style presentations, but then it all stopped working and the link was broken. So just click on it every now and then to see if anything is happening as Andreas thinks the next posts here and elsewhere should be when the "Dreamair" gun is officially launched. Hopefully that will not be too far away as I have been “stoking the fire” so to speak in order to maintain interest and build momentum.
infinitengines-2.jpg
 
Last edited:
Reactions: Zahar and foxfish