Picasso Cent Pacific or RA or Rabitech..

[calispearo]

I'v been tossing and turning over which gun to buy. I live in Southern California and i will mainly be using it for reef and kelp. I'm looking for something with range, accuracy and something that still isn't too big to take around the reef all day, probly a 110cm or a 100. Price is not a factor, i'm just looking for the best gun out there for my purpose. A good meat and potatoes gun for what i do.


1)
I was really eyeing the Picassso Century Pacific Railgun. It had the integrated rail and i loved the dual band muzzle and the fact that you could use screw on bands. I heard they have safty problems though. can anyone elaborate??????? Are they dangerous?

2) I was liking the Rabitech but the rail isn't integrated into the gun. It is attached on after, also you have to tie the bands on yourself. And that can be a problem. What do people think about these guns? how do they compare to RA.

3) RA .... does anyone know how these compare to the Rabitech? how do you load it without a loading pad??

4), last but not least, the RIFFE Hawiian or No Ka Oi model. (mid Handel Series) I like everything about them. Except i heard around that they do not shoot straight???? does anyone have any insight..


Help!!! lol, loosing major sleep over this.


- Sleepless in California

 

[defofthecrown]

Hey,

I've seen the new Picasso gun this summer but didn't get a chance to shoot it. As crappy as this sounds I really think a speargun is a simple device and once you get into the level of euro gun your looking at you can't go too far wrong (but believe me i know how you feel).

I shoot a rabi. 120 and 80 personally. I love them and their deadly accurate. The rail is applied with a marine adhesive after the barrel is produced. I haven't heard of any delaminating. The bands are also bulk rubber, just like the RA. It's actually nicer b/c you don't have to screw them in so you can tie your own bands if thats your thing (It's very easy and saves cash). If you shoot a single band you can take it on/off w/out tying. It just takes some soap and outward pressure. The slot for the second band does have to be tied in. This is also good because then your equiped to easily change a wishbone if one breaks (look for an old post be shadowkiler for details...)

The rob allen is available w/ a loading pad I thought. I think I remember something about them redisgning it a year or two ago. I know I wouldn't want to take the loading pads off my rabitechs.

The RA and rabi are both great. The rabi shoots higher the RA lower so don't switch back and forth- with either after two shots you'll be hitting whatever you want. The Picasso grip is actually the same as the RA while the rabi's is the same as sporasubs. It say get whatevers cheaper in your area.

As far as the larger riffe midhandles I've heard the same thing. Apparently their a little underballasted. This results in the gun kicking (occasional tooth loss :blackeye ) and shots going low. If your not afraid of a drill press and propane torch you can add your own ballast or cough up more cash for some float wings.

If price isn't a factor look into a wong hybird. It will be ballasted, has a lifetime warranty, and rave reviews. Of course for the price of one you could pick up a couple of rabi's- say 110 and 90- and have your bad vis. days covered as well.

 

[Murat]

Hey,



The RA and rabi are both great. The rabi shoots higher the RA lower so don't switch back and forth- with either after two shots you'll be hitting whatever you want.

rofl rofl rofl May be he should buy something else which will shoot straight anyway...

If money is no problem and you want best, there are others to consider.

 

[calispearo]

thanks defofthecrown,

What do you think about PIcassso's safty issues and there all about the same price where i am. I was thinking about doing exactly what you were saying. Getting a 110 and then getting a 80 for holeIS Rs and bad vis.

Does it get annoying tying your own bands on the Rabbi? ( i don't trust anything i do myself... j\k)

I'v seen all guns in person and i liked the picasso and the Rabbi stealth the best. (haven't seen RA though) is RA better because the track is built in to it?

And when the safty on the PIcasso fails does it fire while it's being loaded or is it only when you pull the trigger and the safty's on. Will it fire without pulling the trigger?

Thanks for the help guys... this is really driving me crazy!

What would you suggest that shoots straighter

 

[calispearo]

(meant that last question for Murat) what guns would be better?

 

[defofthecrown]

Muat -RELATIVE- to one another. Just because something goes higher or lower than your natural aiming doesn't mean it's not straight. It shoots straight you aim high or low based on feature of the guns. You can't tell unless your used to shooting both guns. Why don't you grab two of your guns, shoot one 10 times, then fire the second aiming exactlly the same. I've got a handful of guns and you have to get used to working w/ all of them. What do you think Tiger Woods would do if you gave him a new set of golf clu....oh wait, that whole nike thing (kidding, but you get the point).

Cali- they both shoot straight. I only use one band on both of my guns so you probably won't even need to tie any bands. It's so simple however. If you decide to get a rail gun just send me a pm and I'll give you a call and talk you through, or draw a diagram. In fact I think most of the major US spearfishing store online sites have instructions on their websites if you search enough. I do it a little differently though.

As far as 'better' guns he's refering to the hand-crafted wooden euro guns like totemsub, daipran, etc. Better refers to aesthetics only. You won't shoot anymore fish. But if you want to look cool in the parking lot.... Seriously, their all very pretty and I would love to add one to my collection (but I'll just copy one on the old table saw ).

As far as the safety goes alot of people removed this on the picasso/ra to set up a breakaway rig in that slot. Don't worry about the safety on any of them. You'll hear about euro's going off occasionally. There are lots of reasons- debris in the mechanism, not properly load spear, too much band power, etc. I mean every one with a euro shoots it x number of times a year and if it was a 'real' problem you'd hear acconts of it happening ALOT more.

Lastly, I wouldn't get a 110 and an 80 b/c it leaves no room imbetween. Stay even or odd. That was you can go 140,120,100,80 or 130,110,90,70. It's just a contigencey if the need for a shorter/longer gun arises. Sort of silly and anal, but if your buying new at the same time anyway it won't hurt.

 

[Murat]

Well... wellll...

My first gun was OMER MB 30/86 the green ones. It used to shoot high, and belive me as a newbie, it tooks some time for me to figure out it shoots high. After i relize that my hit ratio increased greatly. But this not the thing you wanna to have on your first gun. It did not take long for me to change it with something better. After that gun, all the guns i tried and shoot just shoot straight. For aiming, there are not many variations on aiming isn't it? Basically two types and belive me if you do it correct your gun should shoot the straight no matter what.

Those guns you mentioned has many advantages other than asthetics. May be your experiance or needs does not enough to justify it!!! But they have...

Calispero, i don't know your hunting grounds so can not help you to choose the one that will perfectly fit you. What i can is to tell you which gun has better technical properties than others.
You should first decide if it will be wood or carbon? single or double band? I did not mentioned the price since you have no problem with it. They are not extremly expensive anyway....

 

[LaJollaFreedvr]

i hunt in exactly the same conditions that you do.

i own a Rob Allen.

i own a Riffe.

both excellent guns, very different...whoever told you that riffes dont shoot straight is pretty much wrong...it all depends on your band/shaft configuration. if youre gonna be hunting more in the kelp, get a riffe, no ka oi would be too long to hunt inshore with....inshore kelp/reefs/sand i use a Comp 1x with 3 5/8 bands an a 9/16 shaft...outer kelp i use a rob allen 130 with (soon to be) twin 18mm shortened bands, and a 7.5mm shaft. a rob allen 90 or 100 would be great for socal inshore, but then again so would a riffe....go with what works out better financially for you, but if you can afford a riffe, then by all means get one

 

[LaJollaFreedvr]

i forgot to add:


PICASSO GUNS ARE ABSOLUTE TRASH - definitely one of the worst euro guns out there...with the exception of a few of the higher end models, they are overpriced, underpowered, too thin of shafts for what you want to hunt and fragile. in a word - they suck. and yes, screw in bands, while convenient, CAN snap and shoot back towards your eyes, but this is unlikely. with screw in bands however, you will have to replace bands more frequently (i used to own a sporasub viper) and they are not cheap

 

[calispearo]

thanks for the info La Jolla and Murat. So you guys all think typing your own bands are better?

I'm looking at getting two guns. An all round gun ( for kelp and outside of kelp and reef as well and some bottom. (until i can start expanding my collection)

And then a short gun for holes and rocks. I was looking at the Rabitech Stealth carbon 80'

I'll get a blue water gun later when i get into blue water. But for now i need a good first gun. Something that has accuracy and range for long shots but is still manuverable enough to take into the reef.

I'm open to all suggestions and please help with the size too. If you all had to get only two guns for the purposes i need em for... which ones would you get and which size? I'm thinking it would be best if my all round gun could either hold two 16' bands and switch to a singel 20" every now and then or more. I'd like the option to have some range on it by putting atleast two 16's. and my Hole gun i'd like it to have punch. something like a 20' band.

Thanks again everyone.

also if anyone is selling old guns lemme know i might be interested as well in a used hole gun or a spare gun for my Dive buddy.

Here's my eqiupment breakdown so far, lol. I only have one old gun.

Picasso Black Termic Mimetic 5 mil suit (love it)
OMER Abyss mask (had the Alien... wouldent fit me) Love it. Kindo low vision though.
OMER zoom pro snorkle... love it.
Omer 5 mil socks.. love em
OMER MIllenium standark black fins. Love em.
Picasso Amara gloves. There great.
One JBL Carbine... Hate it... realllllyyyyy hate it. have mor eluck with my pole spear.
JBL travel Pole spear... Love it. had it given to me.

 

[calispearo]

Also what's up with articulated wishbones... does articulated mean steel??? lol. and how do they injure people?

and is a built in track like the RA or Picasso Railgun better then the Rabitech?

wow.. i'm asking a lot of questions.. sorry guys.

 

[ajwaverider]

Calispearo. I was in the same boat as you not to long ago.I was thinking about that picasso century pacific and I decided not to get one for two reasons. First it cost more than any of the other railguns(compairing 110 size guns) and I could't find any one that owned one(on here atleast).I have some friends that own picasso guns and they have no complaints with them .You could buy one of those guns that Murat spoke of but it would't shoot any better than any other guns and by the time you
add shipping cost you would have lost money.I had the opportunity to shoot a couple of diffrent guns at the end of last summer and I found out that they all shot straight but not the same .It could be because of the way I shoot,I shoot without sighting down the barrel just like you point your finger at something and hit it that's how I shoot.
If I had the chance to hunt in clearer water more often I would sight down the barrel.
I think the reason the guns I tried shot diffrent is because of the handles were all really diffrent from each other making them feel unsure to me.

Atleast you have the luxury of being able to put your hands on the guns your interested in .You could do a whole lot worst than any of the guns mentioned and even some that have not been mentioned. Happy hunting.

 

[LaJollaFreedvr]

calispearo - sounds like youve got some pretty sweet gear already...just gotta top it off with a nice gun...

articulate wishbones = danger!

if they slip when loading they can really take some chunks out of your fingers..maybe even off...and thats with gloves on too

swtich out for dyneema wishbones


that rabi 80 sounds awesome

 

[calispearo]

Aj wave rider,

What's the deal with the safty's on the Picasso's. will they malfunction while you rloading or do you have to pull the trigger???

and does anybody really know anything about the RIFFE Hawaiian. i was also thinking about the RIFFE Hawiian and the Rabi Carbon stealth '80. What do you guys think? is RIFFE really a good and accurate gun ( i mean does it have a good reputation?) and would the Hawiian maybe be good for an all round gun and still have Power to hunt on the fringes of kelp forests and still hunt inside them and reef?

wow.. even more questions, lol.

And what did you end up buying AJ waverider??

Also does anyone know if the rail on the RA and PIcassso railgun (built in) is better then the Rabbi because it sits inside of the gun (like the RIFFE metal Tech)

 

[calispearo]

Thanks La Jolla for the advice,

I think the two guns i have it down to the most are both Dynama wishbones. The RIFFE Hawaiian "50 Inch and the Rabbi "120 or 110.

(still considering the Picassso though... Does anybody have anything good to say about them or would they advice me to stick with the above..) hehe

 

[defofthecrown]

Well... wellll...

After that gun, all the guns i tried and shoot just shoot straight.

Those guns you mentioned has many advantages other than asthetics. May be your experiance or needs does not enough to justify it!!! But they have...

If every gun except for the omer mb 30/86 shoots straight why would you need something else in the same size/configuration?

As to my experience here's a little guy I got with my lowly rabi 120 carbon. It's an 83lb world record black drum. Now if you want to post a photo of 1.2kg mullet shot w/ a $500 euro gun I'll be waiting...

 

[calispearo]

Wow.. defofthecrown.. is that your story i read in Hawiian skin diver??


That Drum was one of the reasons i wanted the Rabbi..lol.

How far away was the fish?

I was thinking of getting the Riffe (either Hawaiian or No Ka) as my main gun. And the Rabbi Carbon Stealth "80 or "90 as my rock and hole gun.

I might get two rabbi's but i'm not sure. (this is really pissing me off, lol)

 

[miles]

Hiya

Both of those Riffes mentioned use 3 bands. They would therefore be VERY powerful, and recoil (which I HATE!!) will also be felt!! The No Ka Oi is 56" which is about the same length as a 1.2m railgun. With the railgun how-ever, you'd probably be shooting a 7mm spear with a single 20mm, which will be VERY accurate AND have virtually NO recoil, be easy to load (very nice if you shoot lots of fish!!).

Remember, you need only enough power for your spear to penetrate a fish at the end of your shooting line. Powering up a gun makes it in-accurate, or should i say, less accurate.

A 120cm Rabi or RA, with a single 20mm and a 7mm spear will definitely be the way to go. They're powerfull enough, quick to load, easy to manouver in the water and are VERY well priced.

ps. just look at defofthecrown's pictures!!! What better testament??

regards, from another RABITECH fan!!!!
miles

 

[Murat]

I always used screw in bands with articulated wihbone from the day one and never had problem. Actually screw in bands is better for beginners coz its less hassle to put it on. If you tie bulk rubbers unbalanced of sides it will shoot inaccuratelly (as far as i know).

ajwaverider,

The guns i mentioned on somewhere else shoots much better than standart euros, to understand it you have to know little about speargun ballistics and use one....

This does not mean you can not get fish with other guns. If the fishes are whale sized, stupid there you even don't need speargun to get them. rofl

I don't understand how you guys are so sure that those wooden guns does not shoot any better than you average eurogun????

I used several types guns, alluminum tube, carbon tube, wood barell and i can definitely say they are much better for me...

 

[Murat]

defofthecrown,

you are mixing apples with oranges........thats not about you and me, thats about spearguns..which seems you know nothing about it.

if you are so talented why you just don't come here and show me how to shoot the big fishes?????

I am sure you will blame Alberto March, Pedro Carbonel, Valerio Grassi, Marco Bards, and others for shooting small fihes for your standarts....