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Question regarding tables

Thread Status: Hello , There was no answer in this thread for more than 60 days.
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E

EIias

Member
Jul 11, 2017
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0
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I'm a beginner, 18 yo and started doing tables a few days ago.

Now I've heard from some people that, regarding co2 tables, you should not hold your breath for longer than 50% of your personal best time. Is that true?

First table I did was a table that was suggested to me in which you decide for yourself for how long you hold your breath as opposed to a fixed table. Now my personal best is around 2:30, does this mean I shouldnt hold my breath for longer than 1:15 when doing co2 tables? Because first table I did I held my breath for a period of time ranging from 1:30 to 2:10.

Is this too much, should I step back a bit?

Thank you very much for reading this :)
 
Kodama

Kodama

Well-Known Member
Jun 20, 2016
436
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For instance to calculate a CO2 table you can start with 60% of your PB and decrease your breathing with 15 seconds.
Your PB is 2:30 x 60% = 1:30
breath 1:25 hold 1:30
breathe 1:10 hold 1:30
etc
repeat 6 times

It seems like you are doing fine. Keep it up but don't overdo it since long intens contractions cause quite some stress on the body.
I personally don't do tables more than 3 times a week.
 
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E

EIias

Member
Jul 11, 2017
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Thank you very much for the help.
3 times a week, to not stress the body sounds good. But does this only apply to tables?
Throwing a single dry breathhold in between the "rest days" to check how my PB is doing shouldn't do any harm, right?
 
Tim B.

Tim B.

Member
May 1, 2017
35
10
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Hey there!

I personally like to think, that the human body is exceptionally well configured for breath holding and the "stresses" that come with it.
If you don't feel bad, have headaches, vertigo, nausea or start developing any other unhealthy response to your training I guess that you'll be alright.
You most likely won't keep up that regimen for extended periods of time anyways.

Listen to your body and its responses to the stimuli!

And don't stand or hold your breath during activities that would hurt if you suddenly lost your motor control or consciousness.

To the more specific question of 50% of Max for tables.
I had the feeling that I was wasting my time for the first half of the holds when I was at the same point as you since the tables I had said to breath for 2 min then hold for 1.30. So I changed it for longer holds and starting with shorter breath periods.

It takes some experimenting, I think to achieve what you need on any given day.

And frankly, as long as I'm on land I'm pretty sure I'll know when I overdid things without having to fear any damage to my system. (has yet to happen)
 
SolidHit

SolidHit

Member
Jul 9, 2017
8
2
13
32
To the more specific question of 50% of Max for tables.
I had the feeling that I was wasting my time for the first half of the holds when I was at the same point as you since the tables I had said to breath for 2 min then hold for 1.30. So I changed it for longer holds and starting with shorter breath periods.

Hello!
Starting freediver here too and I am resolving problem with CO2 tables too. My best time is 3:00 minutes so I am starting at 2:30 breathe and hold breathe for 1:30 and ending at 1:00 breathe and 1:30 hold ofc. Its seems to me very easy and I dont feel uncomfortable even at the end of session. I read you can adjust table with shorten breathe time so I shorten it for 15 sec in each cyclus. Or as you saying prolong the holding time but there we are breaking rule of 50% of your maximum breath hold so is this okay ? Or how we can improving our tables safety ? :)
 
J Campbell

J Campbell

Well-Known Member
Sep 17, 2001
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If your table is easy even at the end then you are not holding long enough. The last 2 or 3 breath holds should be at least somewhat difficult, otherwise you aren't really learning or training anything.
 
SolidHit

SolidHit

Member
Jul 9, 2017
8
2
13
32
If your table is easy even at the end then you are not holding long enough. The last 2 or 3 breath holds should be at least somewhat difficult, otherwise you aren't really learning or training anything.

Yea thats why I am asking how to improve it because if I prolong breath hold I am breaking the rule of 50% so what am I supposed to do? :)
 
Tim B.

Tim B.

Member
May 1, 2017
35
10
23
Yea thats why I am asking how to improve it because if I prolong breath hold I am breaking the rule of 50% so what am I supposed to do? :)

The idea of the CO2 tables is, that your body does not get enough time to neutralise it all before the next breathhold and has to learn to cope with the higher amount of CO2 and still function.
So the goal is to shorten the breath times not prolong the hold times. Start with a shorter breath and reduce till you have only 15 seconds breathing before the last hold.
If that is still too easy, then prolong your hold time by 15 to 30 seconds. Because most probably your PB is already better than you thought. ;-)

I think that below 4.30 min PB the 50% rule is just too harsh, because if you even train just a little 1.30 is not a Problem even from a "cold start".
 
SolidHit

SolidHit

Member
Jul 9, 2017
8
2
13
32
The idea of the CO2 tables is, that your body does not get enough time to neutralise it all before the next breathhold and has to learn to cope with the higher amount of CO2 and still function.
So the goal is to shorten the breath times not prolong the hold times. Start with a shorter breath and reduce till you have only 15 seconds breathing before the last hold.
If that is still too easy, then prolong your hold time by 15 to 30 seconds. Because most probably your PB is already better than you thought. ;-)

I think that below 4.30 min PB the 50% rule is just too harsh, because if you even train just a little 1.30 is not a Problem even from a "cold start".


Nice that is what I need to know:) everything okay then cause I had rly long breathe time (1 minute for last to cycles-as app set according to my PB) and thats why it was comfy for me.. I will try lowering that next session.. And what about improving O2? Are you lowering breathe time too?
Thanks for answers:)
 
Tim B.

Tim B.

Member
May 1, 2017
35
10
23
Primer:
CO2 and O2 tables don't go together. Simply put, your body does not know what to learn, when both are done at almost the same time. Some people suggest blocked training, like 2 weeks CO2 tables then 2 weeks O2 tables as an example.

Both sorts of tables are there to train "atomic" skills. Meaning that your goal is to train only one aspect without having to worry about anything else. For CO2 tables that is only the buildup of CO2 without having low O2 messing with your brain aswell and vice versa for O2 tables.

So basically:
CO2 table -> decrease breath time, hold time stays the same.
Minimum breath time is still enough to get your O2 saturation back to normal and it should not drop that hard anyways.
O2 table -> breathing time stays the same, hold times increase.
All the CO2 gets expelled from your bloodstream and you concentrate on the onsets of low O2.

That is really the absolute, completely simplified basis as I understand it.
There is a lot of very good articles on static breathholds on several pages around the web and some neat apps for android and iPhone on the stores which save you a lot of time once set up.

These two links should set you up with enough knowledge to start and go from there on your own or research more.
https://wefreedive.com/resources/training/2-the-evolution-of-co2-training-tables
http://freedivewire.com/freediving-hypercapnia/

Stay calm and relaxed and happy twitching! ;-)
 
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