Recreational Drugs in Freediving

[bluewater]

Oceanswimmer - I do appreciate you're concern, I just wanted to make it clear that I have had some experience with these substances so my point that I think it is NOT safe to dive on drugs since many people who do use these substances(at least 20% of the people on this board do according to the poll) tend not to trust the opinion of those who have no drug experience in regards to safety issues.

I want to reiterate that I don't think it's safe to dive on drugs, I've only thought about it.

I think the anti-drug policies of the US have done a great disservice to people by making all recreational drugs seem unsafe when many of them have never been proven to cause any problems. This tends to make people distrust information indicating something is unsafe since most of the info the government puts out is bullshit. This has the negative effect of backfiring when people start using pot etc and some then get the idea that they are invinsible. I myself have felt that way at times.

I just wanted to identify myself as a occassional recreational drug user that thinks diving on drugs is a BAD idea. I hope the fact that I approached the subject in a lighter manner makes anyone think that I take the issue lightly, I just don't have the "Drugs are Bad" knee jerk reaction that most have.

 

[OceanSwimmer]

Clarification....always a good thing!

Thank you for clarifying, Bluewater:
It is true I had the distinct impression you condoned diving while under the influence.
Here's why--
"One of my friends who recently got SCUBA certified asked me about diving on shrooms and basically we came to the decision that it just was not safe and not worth it. Now I'm not a prude and I'm considering going snorkling with him(without a weight belt) since we both feel we are responsible enough to do this. But this is a choice we are making in full understanding of the risk we are taking, and all the variables that we can bring to mind that are involved."
-- kinda sounded like your friend decided not to SCUBA on 'shrooms
-- and the decision was made to snorkle (on 'shrooms) instead
-- the implication being that you would be his freedive partner.
Sorry if I misunderstood.

 

[David Biron]

Drug Use

Bluewater - Don't assume that people who say "Drugs are Bad" are giving you a "Knee Jerk" reaction. I was a recreational Pot smoker like yourself from 17 - 25, until I joined the Navy. In the 8 yrs that I smoked pot, I couldn't understand why it was illegal and felt it was safer than alchohol. Having said that, in retrospect, smoking pot never helped me to acheive anything. Fact is, it seemed to suck energy from me. I often got very tired after smoking it. This is the same drug which has a clinical benefit when used by patients suffering from glaucoma.
If you have a physical or mental condition where the use of drugs improves your quality of life, I'm all for it. If you are physically and mentally fit, ask yourself why you feel you need the drug. If you want to relax, go run 5 miles or better yet go freediving. Also, if you are a recreational user, ask yourself if you can stop for 2 months. If that would be very difficult , then maybee you are more than a recreational user.
I'm not saying all drug use is bad, I am saying, strong healthy people using drugs recreationally are not benefiting in any way from this use. Chalenge yourself .....participate in self improving activities not self destructive ones. Only then will you have the chance to see what your true potential is.

Good Luck

 

[pkotik]

WHY I DON'T WANT TO DIE DIVING

The thing that makes me so sad when I see somebody who seems unafraid to die diving is this:

I think to myself : " This poor, poor person. Can it be that this is a person who nobody loves ? There is nobody in the world who loves this person ?"

It seems to me that there are only two kinds of person who can be cavalier about dying for no good reason: a person who nobody loves, or a person who doesn't care about those who love him.

The first sort of person is sad, and probably wrong. There really are not many people who NOBODY loves. Almost everybody is loved by somebody.

The second sort of person is either a child, in which case this sort of self-absorption is apparently biologically normal, or, if not a child, what we call a sociopath. A broken person, one who is not healthy and not functioning properly.

In any case, it makes me very sad. A person who nobody loves, or a person who thinks nobody loves him, or a child, or a person who is unable or unwilling to care about those who love him - all quite tragic figures in death, all so terribly incomplete in life.

We do what we do - we take mortal risks for pleasure, we take risks for personal survival and the survival of others, and even for abstract causes. We put out fires, we spearfish, we race motorcycles, we go to war. We are human beings. This is what human beings do.

But it is not courage at all to approach these mortal risks by weighing only our personal outcomes.

First, consider those who love you.


Best,

Paul

 

[w3ac]

Where I am coming from

Ocean: No problem for the karma, I think those who dive for the love and purity of the sport deserve good karma.

Paul: I like your stand point. Smooth points to you.

Where I am coming from.

The reason I condemn drug use is because I am a former drug addict. Yes I will admit to that, I was a piece of crap that didn't care about anybody but myself. I would lie, steal, you name it to get my drugs. Marijuana: just the begining. I would smoke weed whenever I could. Surfed on it, dove on it, went to school on it. Believe me, living in Hilo, finding weed wasn't hard at all. Alcohol: don't know how I survived the drives home, can't remember most of those drives and do recall one telephone pole whizzing a foot away from the passenger door one night. Mushrooms: made me laugh my ass off then turned me into a studdering idiot for a couple of days. Fortunately the studdering part would go away but I am still an idiot. Cocaine: wanna invite the devil himself into your body? Rev a line, smoke a pipe, jab a vein it doesn't matter.

Some of you don't realize how fortunate we are that we can enjoy the ocean. Try facing 5 years incarceration. Lucky for me, I got off with 3 years probation. Not so lucky friend of mine who was a promising surfer got 10 years when he got busted trying to bring ice (crystal methamphetamine) back to the islands. I don't know if he was even smelled the ocean in the 4 years that he has been in. Guess what, it may be another 6 before he does. I know people who are my age whose lives are in total shambles because they smoked just an occasional joint in high school. Ever heard the term gateway drug? Yeah, gateway to the pits of hell. Guess what, it gets a lot hotter and harder to leave the further in you go. I know about the "It's not going to be me mentality". I told myself when I was 10 that I would never do drugs. 5 years later I was stoned half the time. When I was 15 I said I would never do anything more than smoke marijuana. Guess what, 3 years later I was a full blow crack addict facing 5 years in prison.

It has taken me the past 5 years to try and piece my life together. Keep in mind that I am only 25 years old. I have fought so hard to overcome lifes hardships. I have fought so hard to win back the respect of the community that I live in. I have fought so hard to win back the self respect that I once had for myself. Why did I have to fight so hard? Because of that occasional joint. Let's just put things in simple terms: drugs, bad; clean healthy lifestyle, good.

I have to agree with Paul, there is someone out there that loves you no matter who you are. His name is Jesus. He was the only one that took my drug addiction away. He was the only one that believed in me when everyone else wrote me off. Conventional drug rehab: got kicked out. Trying to quit using my "will power": yeah right, will relapse more times than I would like to admit. Finally turning to Jesus and asking Him to take my addiciton away and this time meaning it: total instant deliverance. To Him belongs all the glory. Guess what, He also gave me a huge play ground. It covers 75% of the Earth's surface and all I have to do is jump in and enjoy. Thank you Jesus, thank you.

Brad

 

[OceanSwimmer]

...Thanks, Brad..

Brad,
Thanks for nutting up and telling us about a part of your life that cost you dearly.
It takes a huge amount of honesty and character to face a challenge and overcome it. Well said.
Props to you, brah.

 

[Gerald]

@w3ac: Thanks for holding up the name of Jesus

To glean the best from some statements:
@spearooo: drugs are taking someone's judgement, the most important ingredient to extreme sports, such as freediving - great comment.

@pkotik: I appreciate that You directed the thread to some deeper underlying issues: the question of love, selfworth and acceptance.

Fortunately I never had a serious problem with drugs. But I can identify with everybody who has because I also was a lost puppy without any purpose for my life. While I was aimlessly drifting around the world with a bagpack, someone in Queensland, Australia had the guts to share the gospel with me.

Life didn't get easy right away, but ever since that moment, whenever I entered into difficulties, Jesus was right there. I lived 23 yrs without Jesus and so far I have been following Him for 24 years. The difference is like night and day. I have been freediving for 34 years and participated in international competitions doing national records for Austria. I wouldn't even mention this unless I would make reference to my sponsor: Jesus Christ. The only support I got was thru Him and thru my wife, who also believes in Him. My life has been totally transformed by His grace, not by my merit. As a result I enjoy meaningful relationships all over the world, but also in my marriage, family, christian community and at my job. But the most important thing: There is hope beyond the grave.
Nevertheless, I believe that freediving is one of the greatest experiences we can enjoy on earth.

 

[groats]

So here my comment on this as well...

I think i just tell you my experiences with drugs, but first i have to say that yet i never made sport on drug influence. I was smoking wacky backy for some time but weed makes me tired regardless of the amount, so i used it only to be able to sleep when in stress. What i can tell is that it takes away a huge lot of energy, i slept bad with it but i slept. I just cant believe some take it for doing sports, it makes slow, tired and erases all thoughts about exhaustive undertaking. Its not one of the drugs that make you do things you would never do clean, such as booze does. This is what makes alcohol far more dangerous that weed but still i dont have any experience (i cant handle booze, im sloshed after a glass of whine and fall asleep). What i heard of other people is that some take drugs that do not exactly enhance performance when it comes to power and endurance but make them forget mental barrriers and makes them unable to feel pain or exhaustion (like the aforementioned shrooms). I think this is where the real trouble begins. In freediving there is no use of taking substancies that make you stronger because its a mental thing. So taking influence on the mental part is `the way to go` but then, you are getting in trouble with the only device you have to keep you from going beyond your limits, provoking deep water BO for example.

I think that in freediving it makes not much sense to use performance enhancing substances, they will just alter your sensentions of the body`s warning signs but will not enhance your co2-tolerance, lung capacity, equalisation whatever.
Everyone is free to have his good-night-puff, to each his own decision,you`ll just be tired the next day....

To david biron: congrats i m sure it took an awful lot of discipline and simply, well, `b****cks` to change your life like that. Congratulations!

Greets to all, Joe

 

[Dark&Cold.Diver]

24 hours before a dive i usually smoke opium , and have some teqiulas , that increases my divingtime with 80% !!!!!
Nah! Seriously i think that this discussion is stupid !
Drugs dosnt have anything to do with free-diving in my opinion, i cant see why divers should discuss this issue with eachother?
Drugs is a social problem , even weed and alcohol is a social problem.
It think its great with a forum where people can disscus everything related to their intrests.
But where do the drugs come in?
I wont interfer in what each individual decides to do with their life, but i think it stinks when theres some people that has a very liberal sight to what they are doing (using drugs).
And post them here, its a pity for the sport !
I hope that no ones will relate what some people say to the sport in general .
Everyone should have the freedom to express their beliefs as long as it isnt harming anyone, and i hope some of discussions on thos thread doesnt .

Jeppe.

 

[Alimar7]

Views

Okay i started this Thread, and i very stonrgly disagree with what your saying. I dont think drugs like alchohol or weed are a problem. Thats just my oppinion but why is a drug like weed such a problem. Okay if smokeing it is taken to far, and im talking like 20 reefs a day, its going to really do some damage. But if its just recreataional, whats the problem.
If we Focus on freediving, a couple of joints the night before, is nothing bad. Diveing is a social thing, well at least for me and most of the people i know. Im sure weve all felt pretty alone out there when its just you and theres thirty metres of water over your head. But when your out with your mates and you come back up and they all congratulate you on a good dive or brush of a mistake, its what its all about. And at night when your all haveing a party on the beach or all chilling in a midge ridden tent haveing a couple of beers i see no problem with a couple of joints. It will be completley out your system within 6 hours.

Sorry im ranting a bit, basically my view is that anything in moderation is okay. Im sure theirs going to be lots of reply arguing the case for and against but to be honest im going to be too stoned or too far under to take much notice.

Oh if any one is up in near edinburgh and fancies some diving give me a buzz

 

[cjborgert]

DB Speaks

I'm informed by my superiors (I know, I know, everyone is my superior) that I speak for DB when I choose to, so be advised that herein I choose to do so.

Deeper Blue does not believe that anything in moderation is OK, especially not while freediving. Even a little of the wrong thing can be fatal - a little bad judgement; a little less vigilance; a little altered physiology - can kill you or others. By the time you increase from a little to a moderate amount, your risk level is beyond anything acceptable to most freedivers.

As a pharmacologist with nearly 20 years experience evaluating the effects of illicit drugs, I feel very comfortable arguing my point from the stance of scientific data: cannabis does diminish vigilance and impair judgement.

In addition to speaking for DB on this issue, I believe I also speak for the vast majority of the freediving community: we don't condone the use of illicit drugs, alcohol, or even certain prescription medications while freediving, and we caution everyone against this practice.

So speak what you will Alimar, but you are among a small minority that does not represent our views, and frankly, we think your views are destructive of freedivers and freediving alike.

You might want to visit the NORML chat rooms - I think you'll find a more receptive audience there.

 

[Alimar7]

Shot Down

Okay, Well first i agree with you. I would never drink smoke or do anything stupid before a dive. Or on that note dive with anyone who has. What im trying to say, just not very well, that i feel its okay on the night before when your sitting on the beach to chill. And then the next day im not planning on doing stupid depths just floating around on the surface maybe going down a bit. If u take the social aspect away from freediving it looses a large part of it appeal. But on the other hand i wouldnt say for a second that you need grass or alcohol or anything like that to enjoy socialising.


Im sorry if everyone got the wrong end of the stick but i guess im not the best at explaining myself.

Think ill go and dodge tha tankers in the firth for a while.

Ali

 

[samdive]

on one of my first ever freedives, I went out with an "instructor" who had spent the morning smoking grass. It was just me, him and a friend of mine who was also a newbie. The place he chose for us to freedive was deep, with a current and to top it all the boat dropped us, went away and was due back one hour later. So basically we were floating around in the blue, with nothing to hold on to but one tiny float and then I had a samba.... the instructor was far too out of it to notice. Luckily my mate did and although neither of us had had any training in what to do, she kind of worked it our instinctively and held me out of the water. Now I have to live with her telling the whole world how she saved my life....
and yes.. dope does make you less vigilant!

Sam

 

[aude]

are you serious?

I never did a dive under the influence of any drugs but I don't even understand how some of you can!
Nobody knows the effect of medecal drugs on the body at high dephts. I do think that if you're trying too kill yourself there is always an other way.
Now, if you take substances to help yourself in sport, there is no use for you to practise. You're vain to think that you were able to do a PB with the help of drugs, no matter which one. Dive safely, completly clean, and then you will see if you are that great down there. Don't play your life and the one of your buddy, for just a "stupid" thing such as a PB

enjoy

aude

"CAminante no hay camino, se hace camino al andar"
antonio machado

 

[1 Tadpole]

Alimar7, express yourself, drug yourself, but don't hurt anyone or take any innocent people with you in the process.

Survival of The Fittest and Natural Selection WILL prevail here dude!

 

[pyro]

Very interesting, perhaps you should also do something simillar on www.bluelight.nu it is a forum to talk about any drugs. Anyway, I guess you can say I dived wile being high on weed, but that wasn't in a depth of more than 5meters, I don't think I would dive on any other drug, I don't really fancy weed no more, I don't want to go onto coce/h/e - altho I have tried e and did like the trip, I mostly do shrooms, and if you go diving wihile hallucinating you are most likely to start talking to the nearest fish or something!

 

[StretchArmStron]

drugs are bad...mmmkay?....

 

[Roland]

I did and witnessed a lot of common medication (not drugs) being used in and during sport.

Simple things like nose drops (xylometazoline hydrochloride), antibiotics, asprin, corticostereoids, anty allergy medication, anti coughing syrup, sudafed (pseudoepifidrine). Things many people would call harmless and in some countries are even sold without prescription. I noticed that sometimes people can take huge doses of them and notice no side efects. But then there suddenly is the odd day with the same person and even a low dosage causes huge side efects without any warning.

Even if medcine (or drugs) can be taken safe many times there can be that odd day when the negative effects suddenly kick in terribly hard. Doctors often do not know the full efect of medication when sporting and this is especially true with freediving. Many common doctors would probably not realize the effect simple household asprin can have while freediving.

Even if a doctor says a simple medication is safe for freediving use it with care and try it out with caution. Although every medication should be considered a risk this could in many cases be considered to be a small and calculatable risk.

People who do drugs (even simple things like alcohol or weed) for fun and like to experiment with it can have no idea what the full extent of the effects of the drug can be while freediving. Therefore it is willingly taking risks with yourself and your buddies of a unknown magnitude, just for fun. Everyone can take risks and die like he wants to but please do not bother buddies or anyone else with it.

If you need to use drugs like alcohol, weed etc. to be able to have fun when freediving perhaps you could concider a different hobby with less risks involved.

 

[BlueIcarus]

Hi, my experience:

About the subject of drugs:
--------------------------------

Note If you use the drug to discover your soul (and please beware thar discovery is something carried out only ONCE (or ONCE in a while) in the same field by definition) or to nurture your ego.
Sometimes there comes a lot of bad feelings, anxieties, worries,sadness... and then you take a dose of your favourite drug, just to protect your ego; instead of seating with that feelings and letting them go; which is the way to 'solve' them, BTW. So you get trapped in a loop where you cannot solve your own problems and even you are not aware of that fact! (be careful with this, THC users . Ego-driven drugs comes in all colours, sizes and shapes . Could be legal, illegal, hard, soft, and so on... )
If your ego is what is sucking up the drugs...
DANGER!! Even food could be used as an ego-driven drug to solve all your anxiety and fustrations.
I've done opiates (they are like taking a huge aspirine, didn't interested me much), estimulants (MDMA, etc.: like taking a load
of caffeine and self-confidence at the same tim) and psichotrophics (SP?: pysilocibine, THC, LSD). These are the ones I was interested in as a tool to expand conciousness (I realize now, they are the laziest and more ephimeral tools). Nowadays drugs just hurt me.
I mean, ok I get 'creative' if I smoke dope, but also get anxious and my heart is like samba-ing. My body is telling.. "no-no". Even I have dropped alcohol. I've never liked the taste, actually... and you'll be surprised how LOTS of people drink alcohol without actually liking it, just for the 'cool' (or social) fact. Ask them. Their favourite drink is the one that doesn't taste much like alcohol for them. I mean, the difference between Rum and Vodka is not the alcohol. Is the taste added to the drug , so the preferences are set aside from it. If it weren't like that, we all would drink farmacy alcohol mixed with water. Lots more cheap, but a lot less cool.

Freediving and drugs?
-------------------------

I won't try. I'm responsible and I care about my life and the fact of other people losing his friend/brother/son, etc. Could be a wonderful experience, but you are putting your body next to a limit and you must know where it is to avoid it. If you can't ride up a hill with a bike while stoned, you simply get down the bike and rest. Well, in freediving you cannot 'get down'. It's like riding up an hill WITHOUT the chance to dismount. You must go to the top of the hill to save your life, so what If your body overstimated your stamina or understimated the hill?. You'll die. So better be sober to know which hill you can ride up BEFORE doing it, so that you don't die WHILE doing it. This is the way I see it.

 

[xsaul]

HI Gang,

Water Rat here.
I furiously DON'T believe in using recreational drugs--especially illegal ones--I've seen TOO MANY loved ones screw up their lives and/or--DIE--from them.
If you can handle a glass of wine with dinner, or a beer after work--fine, really....
What *I'm* talking about is my family's Long Great Tradition of Substance Abuse. ((I don't wanna be like the FAM))....I also have quite a number of friends who have screwed over their lives or their loved one's lives with Booze, Weed, or WORSE.
So--y'all see--Water Rat has her reasons--to HATE the stuff!
I suggest if you're gonna freedive, *have your wits about you, anyway*
AND I DO IT IN SWIMMING POOLS--STRICTLY--DOCTOR'S ORDERS--'CAUSE I TAKE MEDS FOR EPILEPSY & BIPOLAR.