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STATIC - what are you thinking about down there?
- Thread startersamdive
- Start date
Thread Status: Hello
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Hi Tyler,
Boy, I am STILL tryin' to get used to this DB terminology..."contractions'' to me are ''diaphram wiggles"--if I understand what you're talking about. I call deliberate ''contractions''--the kind I use to relax and hold longer "rock and roll."
Still impressed by 8+.....
Water Rat
Boy, I am STILL tryin' to get used to this DB terminology..."contractions'' to me are ''diaphram wiggles"--if I understand what you're talking about. I call deliberate ''contractions''--the kind I use to relax and hold longer "rock and roll."
Still impressed by 8+.....
Water Rat
Water Rat,
contractions generally are a pulse of the diaphragm. Some people have ones that cause the whole body to "rock and roll" and others get a mere quiver. They are involuntary for most people and purposefully stopping them, if not done correctly, causes great tension, pain, and oxygen consumption in the body (physical fighting contractions).
Cheers,
Tyler
contractions generally are a pulse of the diaphragm. Some people have ones that cause the whole body to "rock and roll" and others get a mere quiver. They are involuntary for most people and purposefully stopping them, if not done correctly, causes great tension, pain, and oxygen consumption in the body (physical fighting contractions).Cheers,
Tyler
So Tylerz what's your best way to control your contractions?
please be a bit detailed, as I want to tr myself. As I have them somewhat pretty early, after 2:30 or so, I'm very intrested to learn how to withstand them with low oxigen cosumption.
I find laying on my back on the floor or bed very uncorfortable, therefor I prefer apnea walks and wet static training, the latter with a skilled buddy offcause.
The latest distraction I've tried is counting contractions, I was at 20 at 3:50. The shiffering did also cost extra oxigen. I'm building my way back into the 5:30' and hopefully more. I should be able to reach that with my almost 9L lungvolume and 69KG. Counting contractions is pretty nice variation.
please be a bit detailed, as I want to tr myself. As I have them somewhat pretty early, after 2:30 or so, I'm very intrested to learn how to withstand them with low oxigen cosumption.
I find laying on my back on the floor or bed very uncorfortable, therefor I prefer apnea walks and wet static training, the latter with a skilled buddy offcause.
The latest distraction I've tried is counting contractions, I was at 20 at 3:50. The shiffering did also cost extra oxigen. I'm building my way back into the 5:30' and hopefully more. I should be able to reach that with my almost 9L lungvolume and 69KG. Counting contractions is pretty nice variation.
I should clarify that controlling contractions is not the same as withstanding contractions under, high CO2/low O2, conditions. To work on withstanding contractions requires a totally different technique/approach. So I am not sure which Kars was more specifically looking for suggestions on but I will address controlling contractions a little. I am glad you found counting contractions useful towards withstanding contractions.
I believe trying to explain how to control/stop contractions would be like trying to explain to someone how to clear their mind (stop the mind-chatter) or perform meditation. There are suggestion of what to try, but in the end how one does it is inexplicable. I can tell you how I feel towards what I am doing, but there is no pinpointing exactly what allows it to occur.
It appears that it takes a shift in mental awareness and focus, that encourages myself to realize contractions are not necessary. Then I must maintain that belief without hestitation. I have to relax the body totally to contradict that belief. If I try to stop the contractions from coming by tightening the muscles in my body, then my mind is aware I believe they are coming (not good).
If I began blocking the contractions just as my body was feeling close to getting them, that feeling will suddenly disappear and be replaced by a tingling throughout the body. I can relax much deeper now and the heart-rate begins to drop rapidly. Shortly after this (with expections lately) a strong feeling begins to grow within the body. This feeling is like an all pervasive suffocation. It grows incredibly worse and I have to attempt to disbelieve in it and continue what I am doing. Geneally I can deal with it for maybe 20 seconds.
Lately however, just when the suffocating feeling would begin to build, I instead get a deeper heaviness throughout my body and the suffocating does not occur. This could be a breakthrough.
Anyhow more of that is a description of what I go through than it is an explanation of how to do it. 95% of how to do it is a switch in the mind. I do not know how to say where somebody else's switch lies.
An interesting point however, is that prior to having freediving training and being told about contractions, I did not have contractions and I was performing 5min statics without ANY hyperventilating. There are others who do not get contractions until they are told, as well there are others yet who do not get contractions at all. Seems to suggest that controlling contractions is just learning to remove the habit of what we were taught (even though some people get contractions before learning of the concept).
Cheers,
Tyler
I believe trying to explain how to control/stop contractions would be like trying to explain to someone how to clear their mind (stop the mind-chatter) or perform meditation. There are suggestion of what to try, but in the end how one does it is inexplicable. I can tell you how I feel towards what I am doing, but there is no pinpointing exactly what allows it to occur.
It appears that it takes a shift in mental awareness and focus, that encourages myself to realize contractions are not necessary. Then I must maintain that belief without hestitation. I have to relax the body totally to contradict that belief. If I try to stop the contractions from coming by tightening the muscles in my body, then my mind is aware I believe they are coming (not good).
If I began blocking the contractions just as my body was feeling close to getting them, that feeling will suddenly disappear and be replaced by a tingling throughout the body. I can relax much deeper now and the heart-rate begins to drop rapidly. Shortly after this (with expections lately) a strong feeling begins to grow within the body. This feeling is like an all pervasive suffocation. It grows incredibly worse and I have to attempt to disbelieve in it and continue what I am doing. Geneally I can deal with it for maybe 20 seconds.
Lately however, just when the suffocating feeling would begin to build, I instead get a deeper heaviness throughout my body and the suffocating does not occur. This could be a breakthrough.
Anyhow more of that is a description of what I go through than it is an explanation of how to do it. 95% of how to do it is a switch in the mind. I do not know how to say where somebody else's switch lies.
An interesting point however, is that prior to having freediving training and being told about contractions, I did not have contractions and I was performing 5min statics without ANY hyperventilating. There are others who do not get contractions until they are told, as well there are others yet who do not get contractions at all. Seems to suggest that controlling contractions is just learning to remove the habit of what we were taught (even though some people get contractions before learning of the concept).
Cheers,
Tyler
What you are saying is very interesting Tyler.
I also done 5 minute statics with no contractions before I learned about them. Just at the beggining of reading in deeperblue - the gain of my first knowledge of freediving, when I didn't understand the conspets, I thought that having contractions and having a SAMBA is the same. rofl
I think that the first contractions I had where when doing an O2 table in a freediving course, I still get them in long statics ever since. :hmm
I had 3 assumptions as to why that happen:
1) The most obvious one: to blaim myself that I just don't remember having contractions.
2) The instinct of contractions was dorment, and awakened along with other apnea instincts while practicing.
3) This is actually quite a new assumption: after reading Eric F's co2 compartment hypothesis, I realized that it fits to place with what I used to do only when starting apnea:
my breath-up was just long deep breaths, at a pace of 4 per minute, maybe a bit more, but I was doing my breathup for atleast 5 minutes before a hold, I might guess that sometimes even 8 or 10 minutes. This kind of practice have made me too tired of doing more than 3 breatholds, so I was doing only 3, one for the hang of it, stopping when it stopped feeling easy, second one the same, but was always longer, third time till max, usually 5 minutes. but I don't remember contractions of any kind.
At present I think that assumption 2 and 3 are responsible.
And I can't wait to try your method Tyler, try somehow to UNLEARN the contractions, 10q.
I also done 5 minute statics with no contractions before I learned about them. Just at the beggining of reading in deeperblue - the gain of my first knowledge of freediving, when I didn't understand the conspets, I thought that having contractions and having a SAMBA is the same. rofl
I think that the first contractions I had where when doing an O2 table in a freediving course, I still get them in long statics ever since. :hmm
I had 3 assumptions as to why that happen:
1) The most obvious one: to blaim myself that I just don't remember having contractions.
2) The instinct of contractions was dorment, and awakened along with other apnea instincts while practicing.
3) This is actually quite a new assumption: after reading Eric F's co2 compartment hypothesis, I realized that it fits to place with what I used to do only when starting apnea:
my breath-up was just long deep breaths, at a pace of 4 per minute, maybe a bit more, but I was doing my breathup for atleast 5 minutes before a hold, I might guess that sometimes even 8 or 10 minutes. This kind of practice have made me too tired of doing more than 3 breatholds, so I was doing only 3, one for the hang of it, stopping when it stopped feeling easy, second one the same, but was always longer, third time till max, usually 5 minutes. but I don't remember contractions of any kind.
At present I think that assumption 2 and 3 are responsible.
And I can't wait to try your method Tyler, try somehow to UNLEARN the contractions, 10q.
Hey Tyler nice post, right on the money for me.
I gonna try as soon as I can, might be sunday. I recon it sould be a mind thing, and with those it's like trying for a (long) time and not improving much, and suddenly the kwarter falls through.
The 'nice' thing about mine contractions is that they are hard to see for my buddy, but to me the are very clearly. I know my suit is a bit too tight -as my budget- , so the energy of the whole contraction goes to my gut, hart and throat.
"I should clarify that controlling contractions is not the same as withstanding contractions under, high CO2/low O2, conditions. "
That's new for me, contractions when not low on O2 or high CO2.
How to get them? Or Do I have them, but I place them under the wrong catagory namely being short of O2/high CO2?
I do my breathup just Like Deepthought, but only shorter, 3 min for the first one, 2 min between the other 3 attempts.
In all I do 4 breathholds, first one until the first contraction, 2nd until the 10th, 3rd until the 20th (arround 4 min), 4th one 30 contractions. The bad thing is I do it not weekly because I'm lacking the buddy but this maybe resolved next week.
So currently I'm on the building up phase, improving stamina, technique, and finding the 5:33 back and maybe surpassing that.
I found that doing some form of breathhold every day helps a lot too.
Thanks for your insights!
I gonna try as soon as I can, might be sunday. I recon it sould be a mind thing, and with those it's like trying for a (long) time and not improving much, and suddenly the kwarter falls through.
The 'nice' thing about mine contractions is that they are hard to see for my buddy, but to me the are very clearly. I know my suit is a bit too tight -as my budget
- , so the energy of the whole contraction goes to my gut, hart and throat. "I should clarify that controlling contractions is not the same as withstanding contractions under, high CO2/low O2, conditions. "
That's new for me, contractions when not low on O2 or high CO2.
How to get them? Or Do I have them, but I place them under the wrong catagory namely being short of O2/high CO2?
I do my breathup just Like Deepthought, but only shorter, 3 min for the first one, 2 min between the other 3 attempts.
In all I do 4 breathholds, first one until the first contraction, 2nd until the 10th, 3rd until the 20th (arround 4 min), 4th one 30 contractions. The bad thing is I do it not weekly because I'm lacking the buddy
but this maybe resolved next week.So currently I'm on the building up phase, improving stamina, technique, and finding the 5:33 back and maybe surpassing that.
I found that doing some form of breathhold every day helps a lot too.
Thanks for your insights!
I don't know if trying to get rid of contractions altogether is such a good idea - I have lost them (not on purpose) and now find it easy to go over the limit accidentally. However, I can't complain about the longer times I can now do!
naiad
naiad
What do you mean Lost them?Originally posted by naiad
I don't know if trying to get rid of contractions altogether is such a good idea - I have lost them (not on purpose) and now find it easy to go over the limit accidentally. However, I can't complain about the longer times I can now do!
naiad
I'm very interested to know - how did that happen? could it be that I've found what you've lost?
Just to clarify, what I wrote up there was my breathup before I started to do more statics, than I cut the breathup to normal times since it seemed reasonable that more statics and less breathing would be the thing I needed then. And maybe as a result of that I got familier with contractions. That was one of my assumptions.
nowdays, I don't do any breat-up. (soon I'll start training again though.)
I do not think I clearly expressed myself there. I was just trying to clarify that we were not talking about 2 different things.
Namely that withstanding contractions is the idea of having contractions and working towards the contractions not being the cause of ending one's static.
While controlling contractions is the idea of influencing oneself to not have contractions or controlling the characteristics of the contractions (such as frequency and intensity).
So we are in agreeance that contractions occur under high CO2 conditions.
Latest wed Static report, intresting findings
I'm just back from wed static training, and did a nice discovery.
Like I said I went for 4 static attempts.
3 min preperation, slow abdominal breathing through alternating noseholes.
1: more like a warm up, quit on the first contraction.
2min pause, with same breathing until 30 sec before OT, then a 2 quicker deep full breaths, which the last one is ending in a full out. Then final breath in, a bunch of extra packs of air. I figure it's good to train to hold a large amount of air in a tied suit.
2: waiting for 10 contractions, here the new things start. The contractions started really soft this time and remaind mild.
rest: 2 min, like mentioned above.
3: Waiting for 20 contractions, waiting waiting... Hmm my buddy was checking me randomly, but the contractions kept away for a long time. By the time it started, it started like above, very soft. I feld them but needed to focus to feel them or I would loose count. The intensity were in a sort of wave pattern, soft -> mild -> soft - mild. Then I finally arrived at the 20, it took so much time to reach 20, I was a bit surpriced.
4: Initially I would go for 30. As I went allong counting contractions I got lost in counting, I didn't care anymore about counting since the were so mild and soft and slow to arrive. It seemed to mee they are almost gone? At the end of this "85%" attemt I sort of missed the fighting attitude, so I got up very relaxed, needed any recovery breaths. I was satisfied with the training and new findings. My contractions are soft and mild when I pack more. Then my buddy told my latest time, 4:59, I was nicely surpriced! Great time concidering the efford put into, and I'm back on my former performance level. The week before I did with about same effort a small 4. I now feel so confident that I can reach the 6 in a few weeks.
I think it's key to practice every day, and overall stanima is key for my good times. So I'm planning more cycling etc.
Here are the times:
* 1st 1 contraction 2'05"
* 2nd 10th contraction 3'59"
* 3rd 20th contraction 4'34"
* 4th - not counted - 4'56"
Ciao!
Kars
I'm just back from wed static training, and did a nice discovery.
Like I said I went for 4 static attempts.
3 min preperation, slow abdominal breathing through alternating noseholes.
1: more like a warm up, quit on the first contraction.
2min pause, with same breathing until 30 sec before OT, then a 2 quicker deep full breaths, which the last one is ending in a full out. Then final breath in, a bunch of extra packs of air. I figure it's good to train to hold a large amount of air in a tied suit.
2: waiting for 10 contractions, here the new things start. The contractions started really soft this time and remaind mild.
rest: 2 min, like mentioned above.
3: Waiting for 20 contractions, waiting waiting... Hmm my buddy was checking me randomly, but the contractions kept away for a long time. By the time it started, it started like above, very soft. I feld them but needed to focus to feel them or I would loose count. The intensity were in a sort of wave pattern, soft -> mild -> soft - mild. Then I finally arrived at the 20, it took so much time to reach 20, I was a bit surpriced.
4: Initially I would go for 30. As I went allong counting contractions I got lost in counting, I didn't care anymore about counting since the were so mild and soft and slow to arrive. It seemed to mee they are almost gone? At the end of this "85%" attemt I sort of missed the fighting attitude, so I got up very relaxed, needed any recovery breaths. I was satisfied with the training and new findings. My contractions are soft and mild when I pack more. Then my buddy told my latest time, 4:59, I was nicely surpriced! Great time concidering the efford put into, and I'm back on my former performance level. The week before I did with about same effort a small 4. I now feel so confident that I can reach the 6 in a few weeks.
I think it's key to practice every day, and overall stanima is key for my good times. So I'm planning more cycling etc.
Here are the times:
* 1st 1 contraction 2'05"
* 2nd 10th contraction 3'59"
* 3rd 20th contraction 4'34"
* 4th - not counted - 4'56"
Ciao!
Kars
Michael, what I meant by losing contractions was as follows. I have been doing statics for about a year, and until recently I would always get a lot of weak contractions, about one per second, for the last 0:45 - 1:30 of a static. A few weeks ago I started not to get so many on the third attempt - I managed a PB of 5 minutes without even getting one. Over the next three weeks they disappeared altogether, and now I never get them even on the first attempt. This does not mean I am not pushing the limit - last week I did a great samba in pool training and I did not get contractions.
If anyone else has also 'lost' contractions for no reason I would be interested to know about it.
naiad
If anyone else has also 'lost' contractions for no reason I would be interested to know about it.
naiad
That is very scarry.
And interesting.
Could it be that you've changed something and that you are just not aware of it?
could it be that you are hyper-ventilating?
Do you smoke?
And interesting.
Could it be that you've changed something and that you are just not aware of it?
could it be that you are hyper-ventilating?
Do you smoke?
well,
that may be it right there - or at least part of it -
now obviously there are a lot of people on this list who'll know a lot more than I,
BUT,
just for those who don't know,
the breathing reflex is not caused by a low 02, but rather by high CO2.
Hyperventilating - i.e. 2-3 minutes of fast deep breaths - drops the amount of CO2 in yer system,
as such you are tricking yer nervous system - which makes its judgement on when to breathe, based on the CO2 input it receives - into thinking that all's hunky dory...
I'll bet if you did no hyperventilating, the contractions would come back pronto.
See ya!
Itchy O'Pint Bottle
bizarro-mazarro...
what about empty-lung statics???
take a nice relaxed breath,
then empty your lungs,
then breathold...
if'n you STILL don't get any,
mayb you should consider putting yerself forward for scientific experiment!!!!
there might even b some cash in it 4 ya!!!
:duh
c ya.
Itchy O'Puzzlement
what about empty-lung statics???
take a nice relaxed breath,
then empty your lungs,
then breathold...
if'n you STILL don't get any,
mayb you should consider putting yerself forward for scientific experiment!!!!
there might even b some cash in it 4 ya!!!
:duh
c ya.
Itchy O'Puzzlement
I'm with pint-o, your breath-up sounds like a recipee for hyper ventilation, which is the recipee for a b/o with no warning.
it is possible that with time, your breathing technique improved, and that made your hyperventlation more efficient and caused the whole thing.
Try just slowing down your breathing while doing your breath-up, see what happens.
it is possible that with time, your breathing technique improved, and that made your hyperventlation more efficient and caused the whole thing.
Try just slowing down your breathing while doing your breath-up, see what happens.
I tried doing an empty lung static of 1:00 with no preparation. It was very,very difficult (much harder than 5:00 with full lungs/breath-up), and I don't like empty lung statics and normally will not do them even as training, but there were still no contractions.
Maybe something has stopped working! :duh
naiad
Maybe something has stopped working! :duh
naiad