2014 lunocet

[Philip Fennell]

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Now that you cause me to think about it..... realizing that I've changed to hands forward nearly all the time because of interest in gliding more which was created reading deeper blue. The skin suit suggested here rewards extension with more gliding too. Experimenting with hand weighting really rewards extension. It works so well with the Luno out back and the weighted gloves outstretched partly because the bobbing motion of the hands from the swimming stroke is dampened by the counter weight. That advantage becomes even more evident when striving to go faster.

Conversely hands back with the glove weight removes that advantage so it becomes more natural to put and keep the weight out front where you want it. It almost feels like there is a little motor in your weighted hands! There doesn't seem to be a huge drag at slower speed from lifting my head to look around. No doubt the gloved hands punch a bigger hole in the water than hands alone but there is no draggy sensation like I find with webbed gloves out front. I think that's why the webbed gloves are in the locker while the weighted gloves are in the pool. Used them every day since first trying the idea.View attachment 38524

Has anyone else experimented with hand weighting?

Hello Chipswim,

Just to double-check, as I see comments on Amazon saying that these gloves aren't always advertised the same (some show total weight and some show weight per glove), that the blue ones in your picture are they 0.5 Kg (1.1 lb) per glove ?

 

[Chipswim]

These are body glove brand I got from wall Mart. They are 3 lbs for the pair. I bought two pairs so I can use two left hand gloves. That way my hands still touch each other and fit together really well. The weight is on top of the upper hand and below the lower hand.

Neurodoc! I did like you and just held weight in my hands to try out the idea. I liked the feeling. Don't like weight around my neck. So acted on the idea when exercise gloves came to mind. It is so simple, cheap and works well. I've started wearing the gloves slightly twisted on my hand so they wind up going through the water straighter. Will post pictures of that when I take some. Same gloves just different fingers through the holes. Actually I skip the ring fingers and use the little fingers on both hands and it works slick!

 

[Xaid]

Wow, Chipswim, I think you may be on to something here! I especially was intrigued by what you said about the 'bob' damping effect it has on your form during the kick phase. I just made my own neck weight, and I was amazing by how well it works, in comparison to the scuba belt style that I was using. So, you have given me a new project: design my own version of your weighted gloves.

The 'arms forward' position feels so comfortable to me, it makes me feel more like I was designed for underwater travel. It seems to keep my head and spine in the correct position, and allows for the 'shoulder extension' part of the dolfin kick. This helps me to generate a lot more force. When I get the $ together, I am going to take a page out of AA's playbook and order a wetsuit custom cut in the 'arms forward' position.

 

[Apneaddict]

for DYN, you will be exerting much more energy to keep your arms extended with weight at the end of them. Your form will suffer as well.

For DNF... well... that'd be fun to watch the buoyancy change!

I'll stick with neck weights.

 

[Chipswim]

Thanks for the interest. Strangely I don't perceive any effort to support my weighted hands or any drag. Like I said it feels like there is a motor in the gloves for gliding. It seems there would be some effort to keep them out there, but I feel none.

That said I've never experienced the very extended swims of the real dyn guys. With all the goodies I am able to go the farthest I've ever gone though. I still don't press into any danger since no one around me would understand. I answer the urge to breathe whenever it comes along.

The weighted hands idea is the simplest and least expensive idea to try that I've come across so far. I'd be surprised if a few additional swimmers don't prefer it.

Don't think I have good form available to ruin. Maybe weight out there compensates for something lacking in my swimming motion. Any how I like it.

 

[neurodoc]

It does make sense that leveraging the weight out at the end of the arms provides more dampening effect, and it may also take less weight to accomplish a stable horizontal glide. I may have to strengthen my shoulders in that direction, but that should not be hard if done on an inversion table or roman chair. I haven't gotten to swim with the Lunocet (either of them!) in a week now...stir crazy. Finally going to this afternoon ;-)) yay!

 

[Chipswim]

FEAST YOUR EYES !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I heard of a chance to preorder the 2015 Lunocet !!!!!!! Jumped at the chance !!!!!!!!

Got a SNEAK PEEK !!!!!! TO SHARE!!!

MORE TO COME !!!!!!!

 

[Chipswim]

Things to notice in the first photo:

The bright green extra vertebrae or center link is a major innovation. It can be added to existing 2014 Classic Lunocet and Pro Lunocet models. ( I think... Starting to notice some more variations!) Note the new extended spring design that goes with it. The dimensions add about an inch in length and 1/2 inch in depth.

You can see that there are now two hinge points available sharing the flexing duties. If total fin flex used to be 60° which shortened spring life...... Now each hinge could move 30° spreading the stress over a longer spring area.

I think the extra inch of length may = more propulsion by expanding the fin movement for the same body movement.

For those of you who have been watching since the 2012 Lunocet notice that the ultimate limit to fin flex has returned. That means totally over powering the fin is not possible with this frame in place. The fin will still have propulsion even if the spring weakened which is much less likely since the system has a clearly defined ultimate angle and can no longer be over flexed. The spring itself is not only mechanically protected and preserved but also substantially beefier... Taller.... Longer.... Tougher.

Very interesting innovations!

I have a broader view photo to share too. Wanting Deeper Blue members back from the holidays and excited to see it!

 

[neurodoc]

That looks really good! agree that spreading out the load is a great thing, and the extra length will help as well! The spring should work even better this way. I will be pre-ordering and am looking forward to trying it out!

 

[Xaid]

Thanks Chipswim, please post the broader view! I would like to see the new fluke design!

 

[Chipswim]

Coming soon Xaid!

I'm trying to control myself and dangle the carrot a little longer while we contemplate the advancing peduncle design.

Did anyone notice that the adjusting pins are no longer visible?

What is obscuring them? Is it just a decorative cap or are there additional features and benefits?

 

[Chipswim]

IDEAS SUITABLE FOR FRAMING !

 

[noa]

IDEAS SUITABLE FOR FRAMING !
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Very interesting development. I would also like to see the spring material improved. Something that holds its shape, is more reactive and with a better "return on investment" than rubber.

 

[noa]

Has anyone received their improved spring ? The one with better rubber, not the new version that Chipswim is showing.

 

[neurodoc]

I think one of the ideas behind the newer design is to spread out the load on the spring, allowing it to do more springing and less deforming. This would make the newer version/upgraded parts work better with a rubber spring than the first version does (and I still really like the Pro!)

 

[Chipswim]

Good to hear from you Noa! I'm not completely dialed in timing wise as the Luno concepts surge ahead but I think you are raising the big possibility !!!

If the new spring arrives as recently pictured and you have one of those green center links in the package with it... You just time warped your Lunocet Pro ahead into a hybrid of the future (2015) configuration that Ted expects will set the highest performance standards so far. He has stated that the rubber mixing / curing issue is solved.

Once again excited to see or hear when the first ones get on a swimmer.

I don't know all that is happening but I did get an incling that a control system component failed and was replaced with an advanced version that has accelerated innovation.

I nearly fell over when Ted sent those photos in response to the first 2015 pre order and allowed me to post them. Once again I can't say for certain but I'm getting the feeling the computer image may represent a real existing Luno. If that's the case we've caught a faster gear.....

Photo of today's SUPERHYDROPHOBIC

SKIN SUIT project here at home.... Success!!. Headed to lake!

 

[noa]

Good to hear from you Noa! I'm not completely dialed in timing wise as the Luno concepts surge ahead but I think you are raising the big possibility !!!

If the new spring arrives as recently pictured and you have one of those green center links in the package with it... You just warped your Lunocet Pro ahead into a hybrid of the future (2015) configuration that Ted expects will set the highest performance standards so far. He has stated that the rubber mixing / curing issue is solved.

Once again excited to see or hear when the first ones get on a swimmer.

I don't know all that is happening but I did get an incling that a control system component failed and was replaced with an advanced version that has accelerated innovation.

I nearly fell over when Ted sent those photos in response to the first 2015 pre order and allowed me to post them. Once again I can't say for certain but I'm getting the feeling the computer image may represent a real existing Luno. If that's the case we've caught a faster gear.....

Photo of today's SUPERHYDROPHOBICView attachment 38587 View attachment 38588 SKIN SUIT project here at home.... Success!!. Headed to lake!

Sounds good, eager to experience more...
What I say about materials is pretty much applicable to any system. Think of a classic rubber fin blade and how it behaves. Now go to a carbon finned blade and it becomes alive and kicking (literally), resulting in a completely different level of performance. Whatever component flexes deserves to be in a material that will maximize its potential.

 

[Fredd]

Has anyone received their improved spring ? The one with better rubber, not the new version that Chipswim is showing.

Sadly, and I'm sure I'm not alone in this. Still not received my Lunocet pro or any indication of where it is :-(

New design looks great

Anyway off to sunny Greece for 2 weeks in the beautiful sunshine and swimming in the Med :-D

Maybe there'll be news when I get back.

 

[Chipswim]

Fredd,

You might post or email Ted the exact timing of your trip if there is some time before you leave. Sometimes those swim trip of a lifetime events receive some priority. I think most of us understand the rare and precious nature of a trip like that.... In your case traveling to Noa's back yard!

I guess Noa went on a dive trip to Greece and just stayed.... Not a bad approach to life!

Noa, I'm with you on importance of materials. Lunocet as a project.... Really fins for humans in general ....has been a study of materials. Leonardo Davinci's first design was leather and went on your hands. The Luno flukes have been carbon, carbon core, and now aluminum core rubber. Kind of a twist that less exotic materials are yielding improving performance there. Love what it's done to the price of owning one!

The spring still has to find its sweet spot as you wrote. I'm thinking that green center link in the 2015 design greatly simplifies the spring's duties by setting an absolute flex limit. No over flexing allowed protects the rubber spring from the movement that can speed it's wear. Coupled with the improved rubber compound this could be the answer.... If that's the case this 2015 Luno is THE LUNO we've been searching for!

Note the flex limit built into the center link!

 

[neurodoc]

Nice observation, Chip! I had not noticed that movement limiter.