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AIDA Results Register
- Thread startertrux
- Start date
Thread Status: Hello
, There was no answer in this thread for more than 60 days.
It can take a long time to get an up-to-date response or contact with relevant users.
It can take a long time to get an up-to-date response or contact with relevant users.
OK, so to demonstrate and test the new photo and dive profile functions, I added some to the profiles of Herbert, Will, a Sara. I hope someone will help, and add some more profiles. Have a look at it - there are icons for the photo or the dive profile, left to the date in the row of the respective performance where the images are available:
APNEA.cz ranking - Sara Campbell
APNEA.cz ranking - Herbert Nitsch
APNEA.cz ranking - Will Trubridge - CNF
http://apnea.cz/ranking.html?Molchanova
APNEA.cz ranking - Sara Campbell
APNEA.cz ranking - Herbert Nitsch
APNEA.cz ranking - Will Trubridge - CNF
http://apnea.cz/ranking.html?Molchanova
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Seems to work well - is it possible to edit, and then edit again (in the media function)...? (I added the worng video) and have some problems with just that. Otherwise I will see to check some results and add media. Looking good!
Morten
Morten
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Thanks for the contributions, Morten. I saw you added some links to photos from Facebook. The problem is with the addresses you copy from the browser - it in fact shows the address of the Facebook page, not of the photo. It means it will not show up on the pop-up window. To get the address of the photo, you need to right-click the photo, and copy the link from the properties of the photo. I modified one of your photo links, but will have to look if there are other similar ones.
I'll have to look also on the videos on Facebook too - I am not sure whether it will be easily possible to embed them like the videos from Youtube, or direct links to media files, but I'll try.
In any way, be careful with media links on Facebook, since in most cases they are accessible only to the friends of the owner, so may not show up for most people.
BTW, I also added two check-boxes to the menu, where you can then list only those performance with videos or with dive profiles. I guess it may be quite useful - for example when you want to study the technique of a specific discipline, or of a specific freediver, etc.
I added some videos, but there are not so many yet - around 30 only, at the moment, but I hope the community will help adding more of the videos, dive profiles, and photos.
I'll have to look also on the videos on Facebook too - I am not sure whether it will be easily possible to embed them like the videos from Youtube, or direct links to media files, but I'll try.
In any way, be careful with media links on Facebook, since in most cases they are accessible only to the friends of the owner, so may not show up for most people.
BTW, I also added two check-boxes to the menu, where you can then list only those performance with videos or with dive profiles. I guess it may be quite useful - for example when you want to study the technique of a specific discipline, or of a specific freediver, etc.
I added some videos, but there are not so many yet - around 30 only, at the moment, but I hope the community will help adding more of the videos, dive profiles, and photos.
Yes, you can re-edit as you want. Just the changes do not appear immediately - I have to approve all first manually. Perhaps I'll skip this step later, but prefer having it under control to see diverse problematic entries, before they go online.
I edited two of your photos, and removed third, since the link was dead. I am afraid Facebook generates temporary addresses for the photos that expire after a while, so am not sure whether it will work with Facebook galleries.
I edited two of your photos, and removed third, since the link was dead. I am afraid Facebook generates temporary addresses for the photos that expire after a while, so am not sure whether it will work with Facebook galleries.
Ah, yes, for the re-editing of the media entries, the simplified form is indeed not available, but you can edit them through the more complicated editor interface on the right (the icon in the last column). Once the window opens, click the link "add/edit performance media" at the bottom, and you'll be able to edit the old entries. Perhaps I'll add a small link near the media icons for re-editing too, to make it easier.
OK, so after adding the interface for adding or editing individual results, I have now developed a tool for the full automation of the process - from the competition planning, over running the competition, to adding the data to the central ranking.
This ought to be in fact done years ago. If you go back to the beginning of this thread, you can see that a working solution was available - the Freedive Central system permitted it. Unfortunately AIDA never accepted it, and planned developing own system. That did not happen though, and instead of the few days I though would be needed for AIDA to make the FC system the official data entry interface, nothing seemed to move, and I am now deep in the second year of entering manually several thousands of results each week.
However it has to stop once. I am no more able to continue in this way. That's why I developed an Excel spreadsheet with plenty of automation, data validation, automated data completion that should make the job easier for everyone, and will permit the competition organizer to add results from competitions to the ranking database alone. The Excel sheet connects directly to the server, and transfers all the results with a single click. It can be used for live reporting (sending the results after each round), or reporting the results after the competition in a single batch, once the computer is online (it it was not the case during the event).
Some more details are available in the blog, or on the Competition Worksheet download page. Feel free to download the file and experiment with it, and please send feedback, compatibility and bug reports, and suggestions for improvements! For testing, please set then name of the competition so that it begins with the word TEST, otherwise I may get easily overwhelmed with verifying too many data entries.
I will slowly refrain from adding results into the ranking manually, so using the worksheet will be the only way to get the results into the ranking (unless someone brings a better solution). Hence if you plan any competition, or know anyone who does, I recommend that you become familiar with it, and test it as soon as possible. Now you have the time to request modifications or adjustments. When you do it shortly before the competition, it may not be possible.
This ought to be in fact done years ago. If you go back to the beginning of this thread, you can see that a working solution was available - the Freedive Central system permitted it. Unfortunately AIDA never accepted it, and planned developing own system. That did not happen though, and instead of the few days I though would be needed for AIDA to make the FC system the official data entry interface, nothing seemed to move, and I am now deep in the second year of entering manually several thousands of results each week.
However it has to stop once. I am no more able to continue in this way. That's why I developed an Excel spreadsheet with plenty of automation, data validation, automated data completion that should make the job easier for everyone, and will permit the competition organizer to add results from competitions to the ranking database alone. The Excel sheet connects directly to the server, and transfers all the results with a single click. It can be used for live reporting (sending the results after each round), or reporting the results after the competition in a single batch, once the computer is online (it it was not the case during the event).
Some more details are available in the blog, or on the Competition Worksheet download page. Feel free to download the file and experiment with it, and please send feedback, compatibility and bug reports, and suggestions for improvements! For testing, please set then name of the competition so that it begins with the word TEST, otherwise I may get easily overwhelmed with verifying too many data entries.
I will slowly refrain from adding results into the ranking manually, so using the worksheet will be the only way to get the results into the ranking (unless someone brings a better solution). Hence if you plan any competition, or know anyone who does, I recommend that you become familiar with it, and test it as soon as possible. Now you have the time to request modifications or adjustments. When you do it shortly before the competition, it may not be possible.
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Thanks, Kars. Yes, it would not be bad if national AIDA's had a look at it - if they used the worksheet, it would facilitate the job for everyone, and it would finally allow having the ranking in real-time, and not with weeks, months, or even years of delays. So everyone will profit from it - the organizers (less work, and less tasks to care of), the national AIDA's (no need to make the reporting, and the possibility to add/modify results - for example after protests), AIDA International (their ranking finally working), as well as the competitors (could see their ranking changing already during the competition), as well as the public and fans (if there are any 
)
)
Fantastic. I've taken a quick look and it's all very well laid out. I think it will help people that haven't run many competitions before especially.
I will do a test competition in our usual pool format we use and see how things go. If I find any oddities, I'll send you an email with details.
Thanks for all the work!
I will do a test competition in our usual pool format we use and see how things go. If I find any oddities, I'll send you an email with details.
Thanks for all the work!
I had already some feedback. Apparently some users are confused that most of the fields in the tables are locked, and they cannot be written to. It is in fact on purpose - all the fields with text in black are read-only, generated automatically by the system, making it easier and quicker for the organizer, and also more fool-proof.
In other cases, data validation is used, so if you enter data out of reasonable range, or in a wrong format, you will be prompted with a warning. The ranges are laid out with sufficient reserve even for Dave, Herb, or Mifsud (regardless if you think he takes oxygen anyway).
The biggest hassle are the macros. A lot of automation, and especially the data transfer is done with VBA programming, and for security reasons in most Excel installations, those are blocked. If a system with blocked macros is detected, the sheet shows automatically a warning with instructions how to enable them, but still I hear from a user who has troubles with enabling them. On my mind the easiest way for a noob to make it working, is placing the Excel file to the MS Template directory - it is considered trusted, and on most systems it should work. The typical path is C:\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft Office\Templates\, but it may differ, depending on the OS and Office version.
In other cases, data validation is used, so if you enter data out of reasonable range, or in a wrong format, you will be prompted with a warning. The ranges are laid out with sufficient reserve even for Dave, Herb, or Mifsud (regardless if you think he takes oxygen anyway).
The biggest hassle are the macros. A lot of automation, and especially the data transfer is done with VBA programming, and for security reasons in most Excel installations, those are blocked. If a system with blocked macros is detected, the sheet shows automatically a warning with instructions how to enable them, but still I hear from a user who has troubles with enabling them. On my mind the easiest way for a noob to make it working, is placing the Excel file to the MS Template directory - it is considered trusted, and on most systems it should work. The typical path is C:\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft Office\Templates\, but it may differ, depending on the OS and Office version.
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If you downloaded the Excel sheet yesterday, please get the latest version now at APNEA.cz - Competition Worksheet
The transmission macro was no properly saved with the precedent version. There are also some other minor bug fixes, and further improvements (i.e. conditional background color at rows, depending on the outcome)
It is more than likely that there will be several other new versions in the next few days, as the feedback comes in, so please download always the latest version before testing, or using for a real competition.
The current version is v2.05. There is a detailed changelog at the bottom of the Help sheet
The transmission macro was no properly saved with the precedent version. There are also some other minor bug fixes, and further improvements (i.e. conditional background color at rows, depending on the outcome)
It is more than likely that there will be several other new versions in the next few days, as the feedback comes in, so please download always the latest version before testing, or using for a real competition.
The current version is v2.05. There is a detailed changelog at the bottom of the Help sheet
Hello,
Ivo, thanks for your great work. I understand that automatising the process may be the only possible way forward. I also understand that your ranking is there for all the federations. However, at the moment, AIDA International's Internal Operations and Procedures article 2.6 clearly states that the judges must submit the results on the "official AIDA EXCEL ranking document". This means that organisers have to fill 2 different results forms which takes time. At the moment, your ranking is 10 times more reliable than AIDA's who still systematically exclude some athletes. I am afraid that this duplication may mean that some organisers will just send the results to AIDA for lack of time. I really wish your ranking was the official one but it is not. Perhaps AIDA should accept your form but at the moment they don't...
We need to put pressure on AIDA international to sort out their ranking. It is not acceptable that some brilliant athletes such as Liv Phillip are not appearing in the AIDA International ranking at all.
AIDA is a big organisation. It is no better nor worse than any other but it wont move unless it's members mobilise to let them know that they care about the reliability of the ranking and do not accept that athletes are excluded from the ranking even when their performances are sent by judges.
I am therefore making an attempt to redirect this conversation towards its original title and I ask the different national aida representatives to email ranking@aida-international.org to ask them to find a solution to the problem of athletes not appearing on the register.
Thanks!
Ivo, thanks for your great work. I understand that automatising the process may be the only possible way forward. I also understand that your ranking is there for all the federations. However, at the moment, AIDA International's Internal Operations and Procedures article 2.6 clearly states that the judges must submit the results on the "official AIDA EXCEL ranking document". This means that organisers have to fill 2 different results forms which takes time. At the moment, your ranking is 10 times more reliable than AIDA's who still systematically exclude some athletes. I am afraid that this duplication may mean that some organisers will just send the results to AIDA for lack of time. I really wish your ranking was the official one but it is not. Perhaps AIDA should accept your form but at the moment they don't...
We need to put pressure on AIDA international to sort out their ranking. It is not acceptable that some brilliant athletes such as Liv Phillip are not appearing in the AIDA International ranking at all.
AIDA is a big organisation. It is no better nor worse than any other but it wont move unless it's members mobilise to let them know that they care about the reliability of the ranking and do not accept that athletes are excluded from the ranking even when their performances are sent by judges.
I am therefore making an attempt to redirect this conversation towards its original title and I ask the different national aida representatives to email ranking@aida-international.org to ask them to find a solution to the problem of athletes not appearing on the register.
Thanks!
Hello Kattie,
Thank you for your feedback! We are currently discussing it with AIDA Int - this sheet will likely become the official one, but first it needs to be tested, and some compatibility issues need to be ironed out. In this moment, most of them are hopefully fixed, but still the feedback from organizers at real events is needed.
It is not necessary to send two different sheets from a competition. I am the only person who handles the results sent to AIDA, and I never refused files in other Excel or Open Office formats (and most of them are). I only complain when they come in PDF or other unsuitable formats, but add them anyway (although it costs much more time, and triggers a lot of conversion errors). So sending the results in the new Excel sheet is perfectly OK.
As for AIDA's own ranking - they actually import the data from the Apnea.cz database, so all results from competitions with the official AIDA ranking status, should be there too. If some results are missing, please send a report to AIDA (Jome manages the ranking on AIDA's server).
Until now results from all competitions with the ranking status were included, and are available for the imports to AIDA's server. Unfortunately many competition organizers never send the results. Big part of the results come from alternative sources. In the consequence the AIDA ranking contains also results from organizers who did not fulfill their duty, and often also did not pay the competition tax to AIDA (although they may have charged the competitors).
This will change from now, and only competitions results sent either with the new Excel sheet, or exactly following the rules of AIDA International will be included in the official ranking. It means the results have to be sent in suitable format to the address specified in the rules (calendar AT aida-international.org) within 14 days after the end of the competition. The file must contain all the mandatory data: name of the competition, date, location, judges names, and then at results the following columns: discipline, first name, family name, gender, nationality, AP, RP, total penalty, points, outcome (card), comments, date.
Unfortunately for the competitors it may have the unpleasant consequence that their results will not appear on the official ranking - until now only around 10% of organizers bothered sending the results in the correct way, and only around 30%-40% managed to send it at least somehow (late, to a wrong address, and/or in a wrong format).
Thank you for your feedback! We are currently discussing it with AIDA Int - this sheet will likely become the official one, but first it needs to be tested, and some compatibility issues need to be ironed out. In this moment, most of them are hopefully fixed, but still the feedback from organizers at real events is needed.
It is not necessary to send two different sheets from a competition. I am the only person who handles the results sent to AIDA, and I never refused files in other Excel or Open Office formats (and most of them are). I only complain when they come in PDF or other unsuitable formats, but add them anyway (although it costs much more time, and triggers a lot of conversion errors). So sending the results in the new Excel sheet is perfectly OK.
As for AIDA's own ranking - they actually import the data from the Apnea.cz database, so all results from competitions with the official AIDA ranking status, should be there too. If some results are missing, please send a report to AIDA (Jome manages the ranking on AIDA's server).
Until now results from all competitions with the ranking status were included, and are available for the imports to AIDA's server. Unfortunately many competition organizers never send the results. Big part of the results come from alternative sources. In the consequence the AIDA ranking contains also results from organizers who did not fulfill their duty, and often also did not pay the competition tax to AIDA (although they may have charged the competitors).
This will change from now, and only competitions results sent either with the new Excel sheet, or exactly following the rules of AIDA International will be included in the official ranking. It means the results have to be sent in suitable format to the address specified in the rules (calendar AT aida-international.org) within 14 days after the end of the competition. The file must contain all the mandatory data: name of the competition, date, location, judges names, and then at results the following columns: discipline, first name, family name, gender, nationality, AP, RP, total penalty, points, outcome (card), comments, date.
Unfortunately for the competitors it may have the unpleasant consequence that their results will not appear on the official ranking - until now only around 10% of organizers bothered sending the results in the correct way, and only around 30%-40% managed to send it at least somehow (late, to a wrong address, and/or in a wrong format).
Hi Trux,
Thanks for the clarifications but when i did my judge course I was clearly told to use the official Excel document and the IOP says that they should be sent to ranking@aida-international.org.
Anyway the issue of excluded athletes has nothing to do with organisers not sending the results. There are clear evidence that even when the athletes are on the list sent by the judges some of them dont get in the ranking of AIDA... whether it's a bug on the software used or a deliberate attempt targettted towards particular individuals I do not know. All I know is that some athletes have been trying to get their performances on the AIDA ranking without success and this can be a real problem for athletes trying to get sponsorship or make national selection.
Thanks for the clarifications but when i did my judge course I was clearly told to use the official Excel document and the IOP says that they should be sent to ranking@aida-international.org.
Anyway the issue of excluded athletes has nothing to do with organisers not sending the results. There are clear evidence that even when the athletes are on the list sent by the judges some of them dont get in the ranking of AIDA... whether it's a bug on the software used or a deliberate attempt targettted towards particular individuals I do not know. All I know is that some athletes have been trying to get their performances on the AIDA ranking without success and this can be a real problem for athletes trying to get sponsorship or make national selection.