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Live from Egypt 2006
- Thread starterMonkey Matt
- Start date
Thread Status: Hello
, There was no answer in this thread for more than 60 days.
It can take a long time to get an up-to-date response or contact with relevant users.
It can take a long time to get an up-to-date response or contact with relevant users.
Bill was indeed in Egypt numerous times in the months leading up to the event. Until maybe two weeks before competition start, the organizer gave Bill and everyone else in AIDA a very professional impression that everything was going extraordinary. He had concocted beautiful 3D-images of a barge with rissen tents, he had a very good contact to Suunto Egypt about sponsoring depth gauges to winners and world record breakers, an otherwise perfect website, and all other kinds of sales pitches.
To an extent, I'm sure it was the intention that all of this were to be presented for the actual competition. Only in the last phase did the organizer loose a very important organisational lieutentant (which is a personal story, so I'll refrain from going into details, and don't ask!) and from then on, everything just went down hill. The organizer is aparently a very proud person who is not capable of accepting his own shortcomings, and that didn't serve to his benefit in the mess that followed. Again, it was a miracle that the competition worked, and we owe that to a handfull of right-hearted people, and unfortunately not reasonably to the original organizer.
At least that's the way I see things at the moment.
Chris Engelbrecht, comp judge
To an extent, I'm sure it was the intention that all of this were to be presented for the actual competition. Only in the last phase did the organizer loose a very important organisational lieutentant (which is a personal story, so I'll refrain from going into details, and don't ask!) and from then on, everything just went down hill. The organizer is aparently a very proud person who is not capable of accepting his own shortcomings, and that didn't serve to his benefit in the mess that followed. Again, it was a miracle that the competition worked, and we owe that to a handfull of right-hearted people, and unfortunately not reasonably to the original organizer.
At least that's the way I see things at the moment.
Chris Engelbrecht, comp judge
First I want to thank everybody for their congrantulations!
The main reason for my good results was that I spend a fabulous time at this event. The feel good factor is my secret for good dives.
I could see the ocean from my pillow of my huge 5* room.
I had the biggest TV I ever saw in a hotel room.
The food was even great for spoiled eaters.
The resort was generally great to spend some leisure time and socializing with other freedivers.
There were several pools with water temperatures from 19 – 33°C within a few meters.
I could get in and out of my suit in my own private hot shower (with a good water pressure).
The constant dive spot was extremely close and the diving conditions excellent. We could rent a boat any time or if I wasn’t that lazy I could have even swam out.
I got as much oxygen I wanted every day. And I could even leave all my heavy gear at the diving centre.
Now when I look back at other comps:
Youth hostiles, tents, 5 athletes from 4 countries in one room, bunkers
Never ever I had good food!
Clod or no showers
My resume, I much rather have my start list late.
There was a group of people organizing their own training a long time ahead, with a very bad outcome. I had a great training, but I just “showed up”.
The main reason for my good results was that I spend a fabulous time at this event. The feel good factor is my secret for good dives.
I could see the ocean from my pillow of my huge 5* room.
I had the biggest TV I ever saw in a hotel room.
The food was even great for spoiled eaters.
The resort was generally great to spend some leisure time and socializing with other freedivers.
There were several pools with water temperatures from 19 – 33°C within a few meters.
I could get in and out of my suit in my own private hot shower (with a good water pressure).
The constant dive spot was extremely close and the diving conditions excellent. We could rent a boat any time or if I wasn’t that lazy I could have even swam out.
I got as much oxygen I wanted every day. And I could even leave all my heavy gear at the diving centre.
Now when I look back at other comps:
Youth hostiles, tents, 5 athletes from 4 countries in one room, bunkers
Never ever I had good food!
Clod or no showers
My resume, I much rather have my start list late.
There was a group of people organizing their own training a long time ahead, with a very bad outcome. I had a great training, but I just “showed up”.
Herbert is right...
If you only look at one corner of the big picture, if you’re only sleep, eat and dive and only have to think about your self, then I guess it works to use this hotel. BUT with a team that incl beginners that never been to a comp before and already from the start need stable surroundings, correct guiding and a schedule/timetable that work it was close to a nightmare. I don't think the competitors understand how close it was that the judges had to cancel the WHOLE event. The reason: lack of organization, lack of man power and too many missing details.
In the end I was very surprised how good the c/o organizers, the 5 judges and Kirk Krack took over and run this comp without any obligation to do so. We have them to thanks that we actually have a result list in the end.
Of course the organizer did a big, beautiful work to almost put all the necessary things there for running a competition, and giving us all a competition to remember for very long time.
BIG THANKS!!!
/B
If you only look at one corner of the big picture, if you’re only sleep, eat and dive and only have to think about your self, then I guess it works to use this hotel. BUT with a team that incl beginners that never been to a comp before and already from the start need stable surroundings, correct guiding and a schedule/timetable that work it was close to a nightmare. I don't think the competitors understand how close it was that the judges had to cancel the WHOLE event. The reason: lack of organization, lack of man power and too many missing details.
In the end I was very surprised how good the c/o organizers, the 5 judges and Kirk Krack took over and run this comp without any obligation to do so. We have them to thanks that we actually have a result list in the end.
Of course the organizer did a big, beautiful work to almost put all the necessary things there for running a competition, and giving us all a competition to remember for very long time.
BIG THANKS!!!
/B
this is a great certificate for the competetion and the organizer tooo which at last made bill say the organizer made something goodHerbert said:
thanks herbert for declaring the truth
and hope the blamers read this as even for the proffessional standards everything was good and this as u said helped you
and i think this also helped the other
i think everyone should think of the next comp for doing something i hope to be better
Yes and No...
O2 deeper than 6m is only for 5 min, after this 5 min he DIRECTLY goes up to 6m and stay there for 10+ min.
(you will soon have the AIDA Sled Guidline to read, there you will know more about how to use O2 after deep-dives)
/B
O2 deeper than 6m is only for 5 min, after this 5 min he DIRECTLY goes up to 6m and stay there for 10+ min.
(you will soon have the AIDA Sled Guidline to read, there you will know more about how to use O2 after deep-dives)
/B
Although O2 has been proven to be toxic below 6 meters, there are no “absolute” limits. Hyperoxia results from too much O2 and it is caused by exceeding the exposure limits - both time and the partial pressure limits.
The Lorrain Smith effect (full body or pulmonary toxicity) occurs when the PPO2 increases slightly, approx 0.5 bar, but is breathed for an extended period.
The Paul Bert effect (CNS toxicity) occurs where a high PPO2, rather than time, causes hyperoxia.
Although a PP02 of 1.6 is regarded throughout the scuba diving world as the maximum, it is possible to breathe oxygen below 6 meters. The problem is that nobody knows for how long or at what depth.
Also bear in mind that individuals are different so their tolerances vary and various other factors can influence the situation: cold, work rate, etc.
The Lorrain Smith effect (full body or pulmonary toxicity) occurs when the PPO2 increases slightly, approx 0.5 bar, but is breathed for an extended period.
The Paul Bert effect (CNS toxicity) occurs where a high PPO2, rather than time, causes hyperoxia.
Although a PP02 of 1.6 is regarded throughout the scuba diving world as the maximum, it is possible to breathe oxygen below 6 meters. The problem is that nobody knows for how long or at what depth.
Also bear in mind that individuals are different so their tolerances vary and various other factors can influence the situation: cold, work rate, etc.
Sorry friends,
I would like back to the roots. The circumstances of this world championship are a crossroad for us all. We have to clarify something for our future. Or is all ok? (...until the next wc?)
@herbert: Did you have to pay the full fee? And if you paid it, how much does your own recordattempt cost you normally? (if you organize it yourself). The questions are pure rhetorical. I do not expect an answer.
Sorry Herbert, however with all respect, I think it gives two different aspects.
We are not all world champions and unfortunately we do not all get the salary of a aircraft captain.
I am honestly lucky for you that you made 2 new world records again. But I think that it has few to do with the organisation of this wc and the situation for all the others (athlets, judges, voluntairs, trainers etc...).
I can understand you well. But the organizers should not pride themselves on your opinion. They should not organize your recordattempt, but a world championship for all. My post goes thus not first to you, but at Yehia and his friends.
@dr.hesham:
I am not stupid. Every hotel in the world has a normal price list. But everybody knows they are not the real prices. I found many offers for the “fort arabesque” starting from 16 dollar per day per bed (all inclusive board). You know that is true!
We all remember the big promise from Yehia in Cyprus 2003: “If we organize the wc, everything will be (nearly) free for everybody... we already have the assurance from many people (many ministrys etc): all cost are taken over.
We will organize the best wc ever..."
We all want well organized competions and we must be ready to pay for that. But I will and can not accept, if my passion is used for unconscionable business.
Or do I err here?
(sorry. I edited again for better understanding)
I would like back to the roots. The circumstances of this world championship are a crossroad for us all. We have to clarify something for our future. Or is all ok? (...until the next wc?)
@herbert: Did you have to pay the full fee? And if you paid it, how much does your own recordattempt cost you normally? (if you organize it yourself). The questions are pure rhetorical. I do not expect an answer.
Sorry Herbert, however with all respect, I think it gives two different aspects.
We are not all world champions and unfortunately we do not all get the salary of a aircraft captain.
I am honestly lucky for you that you made 2 new world records again. But I think that it has few to do with the organisation of this wc and the situation for all the others (athlets, judges, voluntairs, trainers etc...).
I can understand you well. But the organizers should not pride themselves on your opinion. They should not organize your recordattempt, but a world championship for all. My post goes thus not first to you, but at Yehia and his friends.
@dr.hesham:
I am not stupid. Every hotel in the world has a normal price list. But everybody knows they are not the real prices. I found many offers for the “fort arabesque” starting from 16 dollar per day per bed (all inclusive board). You know that is true!
We all remember the big promise from Yehia in Cyprus 2003: “If we organize the wc, everything will be (nearly) free for everybody... we already have the assurance from many people (many ministrys etc): all cost are taken over.
We will organize the best wc ever..."
We all want well organized competions and we must be ready to pay for that. But I will and can not accept, if my passion is used for unconscionable business.
Or do I err here?
(sorry. I edited again for better understanding)
Last edited:
Since this will become an official AIDA policy, I would like to ask if anyone has ever considered the issue of long term tissue/cell damage from free radicals? I think this might be a serious problem that could stay invisible till a much older age. Maybe there's a better gas mix to use for reducing nitrogen debt?Billextreme said:
DeepThought said:
I have been having the same thoughts. I do not think it is healthy to brethe pure oxygen after being in a oxygen deprived state. Maybe it is very good for decompression and that might be the most serious problem of the two. However when you try to treat one problem you should be aware of the problems with the treatment.
Many tissue damages can be caused by reoxygenating the tissue. A lot of free radicals is formed wich is mainly taken care of by endogenous "antioxidants".
Wolle,
I consider you a friend and I am not trying to attack you personally.
You were not even there and you really have nothing to complain about. There was a lot to complain about and I was there to see it. To keep complaining over and over is not the solution.
Have you ever put on a WC?
Have you seen the receipts from past WC including both Cyprus events? I have.
I know that the organizer from the Pacific Cup and Cyprus both ended up paying money out of their own pockets and also going into serious debt due to the huge costs they incurred for these events.
Last year in Nice we did not pay quite as much for the comp, but the hotel we stayed at was not close to the quality of the hotel in Makadi Bay.
All that Herbert has discribed is true and this allowed the athletes freely mingle with one another and to grow and bond friendships because of their close proximity. Also the fact that they were eating well and sleeping well. There was a lot of good things and great performances that came out of this event and we should not lose sight of that.
Herbert and Will's record attempts were an after thought of the competition which were set up by the organizer. Annabel even got a shot at a National record. BUT, if what I paid helped organize these attempts I'm OK with that. I feel this will ultimately better the sport and benefit all of us. Maybe one day it will be you making the attempt.
If we were an association such as (in the US) the NBA or NFL where millions of dollars are spent by sponsors on athletes and media, and glitches in the organizing of events could harm the image of the athletes and the sport, then we could really start complaining.
Until the sport of freediving moves into the mainstream media spotlight, we all are passionate amateurs (organizers and athletes alike) and we have to grow and occasionally work together. In an ideal situation we would all be able to "show up, put on our fins and just swim" (quote from Capt. meeting Egypt). But it's not always like that.
So far in the 5 years of competing I have not experienced a "perfect event". If it's not one thing it's another and someone complains about something. Despite all of the genuine reasons to complain about this event, my experience in Egypt was one of the best in my career.
Thank you to Yehia, the voluteers and all who stepped up and helped out whenever and where ever there was a need.
I consider you a friend and I am not trying to attack you personally.
You were not even there and you really have nothing to complain about. There was a lot to complain about and I was there to see it. To keep complaining over and over is not the solution.
Have you ever put on a WC?
Have you seen the receipts from past WC including both Cyprus events? I have.
I know that the organizer from the Pacific Cup and Cyprus both ended up paying money out of their own pockets and also going into serious debt due to the huge costs they incurred for these events.
Last year in Nice we did not pay quite as much for the comp, but the hotel we stayed at was not close to the quality of the hotel in Makadi Bay.
All that Herbert has discribed is true and this allowed the athletes freely mingle with one another and to grow and bond friendships because of their close proximity. Also the fact that they were eating well and sleeping well. There was a lot of good things and great performances that came out of this event and we should not lose sight of that.
Herbert and Will's record attempts were an after thought of the competition which were set up by the organizer. Annabel even got a shot at a National record. BUT, if what I paid helped organize these attempts I'm OK with that. I feel this will ultimately better the sport and benefit all of us. Maybe one day it will be you making the attempt.
If we were an association such as (in the US) the NBA or NFL where millions of dollars are spent by sponsors on athletes and media, and glitches in the organizing of events could harm the image of the athletes and the sport, then we could really start complaining.
Until the sport of freediving moves into the mainstream media spotlight, we all are passionate amateurs (organizers and athletes alike) and we have to grow and occasionally work together. In an ideal situation we would all be able to "show up, put on our fins and just swim" (quote from Capt. meeting Egypt). But it's not always like that.
So far in the 5 years of competing I have not experienced a "perfect event". If it's not one thing it's another and someone complains about something. Despite all of the genuine reasons to complain about this event, my experience in Egypt was one of the best in my career.
Thank you to Yehia, the voluteers and all who stepped up and helped out whenever and where ever there was a need.
well it was a good competition in the end and just as herbert says, the spirit among the freedivers where wonderful! the food was super and the beds where really really nice.
BUT the judges and other people coming to the WC to dive/judge/coach had to bust their asses of to get the competition organised. And for sure they did a good job, after the first day that got cancelled the competition went on smoothly.
BUT - that was not because of the organiser, Bubbles. It was because the beforemtioned people. Yehia did a good job finding a good hotel, he got the barch and he got the boats. But apart from that not much happened.
BUT the judges and other people coming to the WC to dive/judge/coach had to bust their asses of to get the competition organised. And for sure they did a good job, after the first day that got cancelled the competition went on smoothly.
BUT - that was not because of the organiser, Bubbles. It was because the beforemtioned people. Yehia did a good job finding a good hotel, he got the barch and he got the boats. But apart from that not much happened.
Decompression at 10 meters on pure oxygene PO2 2.0!
BIll, how can you say staying at 10 meters on pure oxygene for 5 minutes is adviced by AIDA. If this is true then you better read more about ahyt happens with the body when breathing at PO2 2.0!
I know a friend that acidentally did this for only a few breaths and it nearly killed him!
BIll, how can you say staying at 10 meters on pure oxygene for 5 minutes is adviced by AIDA. If this is true then you better read more about ahyt happens with the body when breathing at PO2 2.0!
I know a friend that acidentally did this for only a few breaths and it nearly killed him!
Based on the last scoresheet I had, it should go like this.
1. Sweden - 1,197.9
2. France - 1,189,7
3. Canada - 1,129.7
4. Finland - 1,113.8
5. Russia - 1,083.4
6. Japan - 1,075.3
7. Denmark - 1,063.3
8. USA - 1,031.7
9. Venezuela - 1,010.9
10. Greece - 999.6
Cheers,
Ben
1. Sweden - 1,197.9
2. France - 1,189,7
3. Canada - 1,129.7
4. Finland - 1,113.8
5. Russia - 1,083.4
6. Japan - 1,075.3
7. Denmark - 1,063.3
8. USA - 1,031.7
9. Venezuela - 1,010.9
10. Greece - 999.6
Cheers,
Ben