Need help. Building a gun.

[Jegwan]

Haha thats actually all very convincing foxfish & jegwan, thanks for the help.

This will be the first project I have with wood but ill be asking a few people that work wood to help out, so I dont get much wrong. All my parts im getting are from Meandros & Alemanni. Im not dealing with Neptonics anymore because I sent them money and havent been shipped the parts I ordered and I asked for a refund and havent gotten any reply from email.



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Like foxfish says - you can't go wrong with epoxy resign. Just follow the instructions very carefully. It's critical that you blend the right amount of resin and hardener.

I experienced the same with Neptonics. But it was all perfectly corrected by him in the end. I got my refund. Sometimes he's travelling and spearfishing. I waited some time for his reply. Send him a reminder.

Good luck with the project.

Jégwan

 

[foxfish]

Just as Jegwan says .. Josh from Neptonics s not always available but his products are the best I have used!

 

[lawstraljan16]

OK great, thanks guys. Ive contacted him again coz its been a little while that I sent my last email.

When I buy the epoxy, what am I looking for? Waterproof (exterior & interior?) Fast drying time? Strength?

Ive ordered all the parts and found iroko at a decent price in malta. So all that is left is the epoxy

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[lawstraljan16]

Nevermind about the epoxy. Just found out a place that sells marine stuff in malta that supplies decent epoxy etc. I asked coz I dont trust mongers here. Last time I bought glue from them after asking for their advice I got ripped off. The glue didnt even hold for a minute, they have me f***ing lilo glue

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[foxfish]

West System epoxy is very good & comes is small amounts, I use fast cure myself but it will set pretty fast in hot weather - probably in about one hour at 25c slow cure is a better product because it has more time to soak into the wood but takes overnight to harden.
Go for slow cure hardener if it is over 20c.

 

[lawstraljan16]

All parts are ordered. Trigger mech & reel from Meandros. Rollergun components from Alemanni, and most likely the roller stopper from ErmesSub.

Ill buy the epoxy and Iroko locally this week. Last question about the wood. I was told to get wood without the 'swirls' so hopefully that wont be a problem? What thickness of wood should I get to put together? 1.5cm?

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[Jegwan]

All parts are ordered. Trigger mech & reel from Meandros. Rollergun components from Alemanni, and most likely the roller stopper from ErmesSub.

Ill buy the epoxy and Iroko locally this week. Last question about the wood. I was told to get wood without the 'swirls' so hopefully that wont be a problem? What thickness of wood should I get to put together? 1.5cm?

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Sounds good.

It's a good idea to check each piece of wood for "swirls" and cracks and pick the most clean when you bye it.
The thickness used when laminating depends on the dimensions of the gun you want to built and how many laminates (3 or 5) you wish to make.
It can be a good idea to chose the thickness of the middle piece the same as the trigger. Then you can make the hole for the trigger and the lamination in one go.

Remember to prepare the installation of the functional parts as handle, shaft guide, trigger, wheels and stopper before you start to shape the wood. It's much easier done before the stock is shaped.

My rollergun is a 3 laminate approx. 60x35mm. The muzzle is approx. 70x30mm.

Jégwan

 

[lawstraljan16]

Im going for an Alemanni Stilo body. Until I recieve all the parts I cant exactly do the measuring properly.

But approximately the front end will be about 55mm by 30mm and the rear end (infront of the trigger aroubd 70mm x 35mm.

Thoughts? What Im most worried about the the line getting tangled when shot so my line will go over the shaft like normal and instead of going under the barrel it'll go onto the side of the barrel.

Please give some feedback about my ideas. Im always open to ideas

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[lawstraljan16]

something like this

 

[lawstraljan16]

Recieved the trigger mechanism and the reel so far. Juat waiting on the shaft and some other smaller parts to get the project started.

First step would be obviously taking measurements. Gluing the Iroko together and then the shaft guide, what side router bit would I need to a 7mm shaft? And any tips on how to do the shaft guide to get it completely aligned with the trigger mech?

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[lawstraljan16]

Reel, trigger mech & 'roller stopper'

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[lawstraljan16]

Rollers

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[lawstraljan16]

Will a barrel height of 30mm be good?

Ive measured the rollers and the pic in here shows the measurements.

I was thinking of the muzzle being a thickness of 55mm wide, 30mm thick. And the rear near the trigger being 80mm wide, 30mm thick. The butt will narrow back to 55mm wide

Thoughts? Its a single band 16mm gun, and will be the length of a 87cm gun.

Ive spent all days measuring the stuff and these seem to be the best I can do? Will the height of 30mm be strong enough?

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[lawstraljan16]

This is the design ive made. Obvioisly the edges will be more of a cuttlefish style. But my designing skills on pc limit me hehe.

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[Jegwan]

Looks fine. 30 mm thick should be strong enough. Check what's thickness the trigger mech. needs. You can make the end of the gun (muzzle and but) thinner if you prefer that.
Jégwan

 

[lawstraljan16]

The parts I bought for the rollers need at least 55mm in the front. Ive also changed the design to a 110mm rear. Ill post a pic of the design by tomorrow. Thanks for the help Jedwag, you're saving my butt of a lot of confusion. I was told to make a height of 60mm snd it seemed way too much as the rollers are only 30mm height.

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[Jegwan]

The muzzle on my gun is 35 mm thick and 70 mm wide. I found my old thread regarding my gun with photos and info. You can take a look at it here: http://forums.deeperblue.com/threads/euro-roller-85-165.97198/#post-907356

My track is 7.3 mm. Remember to take your planned finish (oil or paint) into account.

Jégwan

 

[lawstraljan16]

Nice video. Thanks for that, what distance were you shooting at? Your gun lifted quite a bit, I assume you were hitting lower than where you were aiming? Ill be starting my tests with 16mm band and 7mm shaft with stretch of 350% , what stretch were you using?

Quick 3 questions if you dont mind.

1. How did you determine where the rollers would be placed on the gun?
2. How did you calculate your bands?
3. What pre-stretch were you using?

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[lawstraljan16]

4. How do I take finish into account? How many layers would be best, what product is best to protect the gun? How many mm's should I shave off the wood for this?

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[Jegwan]

I tested the gun at approx. 3m and 5m and no, it did not shoot especially low with how the intuitive aim with the gun was. It was actually quite OK, but the rubbers was to powerful.

@1: I placed the rollers as close as possible to the track and "stoppers". My thoughts was to make a euro size 85 gun, so I placed the rollers approx. 85 from the trigger. I made the gun barrel a little longer than needed, so I was sure to have enough wood at the muzzle to balance it to neutral.
@2: I started with very strong 18 mm rubbers. I decided a maximum stress ratio of 300% for these. I ended up with 170 cm between the lowest sharkfin and most distant anchor point. I subtracted 6 cm for the wishbones and dived it by 3. I have later changed the 18 mm to 16 mm and decided a maximum stress ratio of 320% for these. The optimal stress ratio depends on the type of rubbers and spear you use - and how strong you are.
My gun performs better with the 16 mm rubbers. Less recoil and very long and strait shots. More than 5m with a 7mm spear when loaded to maximum.
@3: Approx. 5% at the closest anchor point.
@4: I used oil, so I just checked that the shaft wasn't to tight in the track. I would minimum leave a 0.2- 0,3 mm space, if you plan to treat the gun with epoxy. I guess 2-3 layers would be fine.

For me the final decisions and details develops when I start working with the wood with my hands. Changes and adjustments are made along the way.

Jégwan