new OMER pneumatic!!!

[popgun pete]

Thanks for the "bluworld" reference spaghetti. I was mainly interested in assessing the size of the bulbous bow on the "Airbalete". I had initially thought that the "Airbalete" was a skinny reservoir pneumatic speargun, but that impression was solely due to looking at photos of what I now realise was the longest model being shown in the first Omer side profile photographs. Although no comparative photos from the top (or plan) view of the guns are available in that "bluworld" article it looks like the "Airbalete" is a bit fatter then I had expected it to be, so not so surprising now that it floats. I did a rough estimation from the Omer catalogue photos, using the hand pump diameter as a reference size and calculated that the wrist section before the detachable handgrip is 30 mm in diameter with the depth of the gun at the mid-section being approximately 37 mm and the widest point at the front being 45 mm. Maybe someone who has the longest model can check these dimensions as they could easily be in error. I asked for this info some months back on this thread, but nothing ever came of it. I expect that the "Airbalete" will be released for the approaching season, that is if the shops bother to stock it as few pneumatics are stocked down here compared to band guns.

 

[ulysses]

... it looks like the "Airbalete" is a bit fatter then I had expected it to be, so not so surprising now that it floats. ...

Pete, there appears to be a misunderstanding.

Airbalete - at least the 90 version I have - does not float. When loaded, i.e. the shaft is inserted the airbalete is negative and not balanced in the sense that it is front heavy like all wet barrel airguns.

Without the shaft the gun floats in the sense that i stands vertically in the water in a muzzle-up position.

I had expected that buoyancy and balance would much better taking into account that hydroforming of the barrel should make fine tuning of buoyancy & balance much easier compared to a round barrel airguns.

Cheers, ulysses

 

[spaghetti]

Indeed, also the article I posted a few posts above states that the 90 feels muzzle heavy, while the 110 has a better balance.

 

[ulysses]

Another review with pictures of the 'object of desire': PSMCAFE, toute l'info sur la Chasse sous marine, l'Apnée, Snorkeling & Photo subaquatique - Articles

*) Mind you this chap is a tester for the French 'Apnea' magazine and like most mags Apnea publishes 'reviews' of equipment the advertising for which actually funds the mag.

Cheers, ulysses

 

[popgun pete]

Thanks Ulysses. I asked way back in this thread whether the "Airbalete" floated and the reply when it eventually came was that it did, may have come from Mark Laboccetta. I never thought that it would be a floater with spear, but was sceptical that it would float without one due to the low water displacement of a smaller pressure air reservoir. More comments were posted that it indeed floated and also that the guns all had varied reservoir shapes to suit can be found earlier in this thread if you look back, however the recent "bluworld" article indicates that the guns all have similar shaped reservoirs with the extra length being in the straighter rear section. That makes it unlikely for anything but the longer models to float and I assume that is by hanging vertical in the water column and not laying flat on the surface. I have been trying to find out the gun's outer tank dimensions to see if floating was a possibility as a wider lateral shape could provide more volume and hence water displacement. Evidently some misinformation has been posted in the past or statements have lacked qualification as to which model length of the gun is being reported on.

 

[popgun pete]

Just to make sure that we are all talking about the same thing let me explain that by a floating speargun I mean a discharged one that floats at or near the surface of the water with no part of the gun body touching the bottom. A gun that is buoyant at both ends will float horizontally at the surface and if it has a buoyant rear grip section then the gun will actually float on its side. The flooded rear grip pneumatic spearguns (which most of them are) generally float horizontally at the surface, but with the rear grip handle pivoted downwards so that the upper surface of the barrel or body tube is just at or breaking the surface. Some discharged spearguns, like modern band powered euroguns, float with the muzzle pointing upwards and the handle much lower down, the gun being almost vertical in the water column or at a slight angle from the vertical. Sinking spearguns either lie flat on the bottom or with one end lifted clear of the bottom if they are more buoyant at that end. As a safety issue spearguns with spears loaded in the gun should not float and most modern pneumatics lay flat on the bottom when they are charged up ready to shoot.

Now without a spear in the gun which of these is the "Airbalete", both with a reel fitted (plus line) and without a reel fitted and are all the various length models the same or are some floaters and others not? With "Airbalete" spearguns in service for months there should be definite answers to these questions by now.

 

[Marwan]

I find it to be quite an interesting discussion, trying to compare a "kitted" cheaper pneumatic to a stock airbalete...its important to note though that there is no "One best" answer. You can make the similar argument that a kitted honda civic with nitro and turbo and whatever else those maniacs do to it, could outperform a stock BMW and still be cheaper...fact of the matter is, not everyone is interesetd in making these mods, some people would fear to ruin the guns in the process (and lets face it, many have), so would prefer to buy the stock gun that meets their performance needs. Depending on your character (into mods, not into mods, experienced, not experienced etc...)and how much money you're willing to pay, you make your choice..doesnt and shouldnt mean by any chance that the airbalete is a rip off, that would be a narrow perspective in my view..similar to the BMW... just my opinion

 

[DivingDane]

Agreed Marwon and if you really wanted to go all out surely someone is nifty enough to make a Dry barrel kit for the airballet and then you would have an even higher specked gun (kinda like buying an AMG 6.3L).

Popgun pete, there are quite a few airballett sold in AUS now, with some going to Adreno, Foster fishermans wharf i think as well, they have been avaialable for the last 6 weeks or so. i've only used my 110 once so far and didnt take any serious notic of the floating of the gun other than it was floating when discharged (has real on it) but will take a closer look when i dive next.

DD

 

[popgun pete]

Thanks DD, I would expect the 110 model to float after discharge because of the length, it is just what happens with all the shorter models. For example "Cyrano" spearguns float according to their instruction manual, but anyone buying the 55 version would find a small rectangle of blue paper inside the package which says "this model does not float", or words to that effect. How happy was I to find that fluttering out of the booklet as I picked it up to read it after buying the gun, although I should have realised it was going to be a sinker. All the others float as there is enough displacement to offset the weight of the ends of the gun.

As I gather the "Airbalete" can be purchased without the reel, my query is what is the situation with and without one fitted. Should be an easy question to answer by now. I have not seen an "Airbalete" in the still chilly south and so far queries have failed to uncover anyone stocking them.

 

[popgun pete]

Just received a spearfishing supplier's newsletter which listed the Omer "Airbalete" as being reduced from AU$999 to AU$949. I had expected them to be expensive, but not that expensive! First time I have seen any retail price for the gun here in Oz.

 

[peacenluv]

STC Italia has made a dry barrel kit for airbalete now, X-power. Has anyone tried yet?

 

[Mark Laboccetta]

Customers in the US are much happier buying from American dive stores because of the tangible benefits. Regardless, a discounted Airbalete starting cost is 300Euros excluding vat in most of Europe. Once you add shipping of at least 50 euros it lands here at world market prices. 350euros today is $525. Last time I checked they weren't in the Duty Free isle of the airport. And the airlines charge extra these days for luggage so it's not to convenient to fly over there and get one for the great savings. The bigger problem in acquiring an AIRbalete these days is availability. Dealers like ScubasWorld, Austin's Diving Center Buy scuba gear, scuba diving and snorkeling equipment, and everything underwater from LeisurePro.com all sell it starting in that price range.

Aside from this, the company, does not support the sale of their equipment to countries outside of the shop's country, in particular when there is a distributor (you might not believe me but I assure you it's true). Sure, globalization is part of the everyday economy for consumer products and free trade is free, however, if the reasons for buying through local dealers were not justified, contrary to your great savings model, we wouldn't be selling out of the AIRbalete as quickly as we can bring them into America. So what are the reasons and what support justifies buying locally even if it may cost $20-30 more? 1. Not everyone is technically savvy. A product like the AIRbalete sooner or later will require servicing (I've taken one apart and there are lots of little parts and the sequence for rebuilding are not so obvious without some practice and good schematics). A change of grease after a year or two, possibly some seal changes depending on the amount of use and the wear and tear the gun goes through will be required. Most people would prefer to have this done locally rather than undertake doing it themselves Or shipping back the speargun to a foreign ecommerce site (considering the cost of shipping is always higher to ship something back than the seller paid to ship it) 2. Warranty. Two years of warranty for all complying products of EU origin is a nice tangible benefit, particularly for a technical product. In Miami a diver who has any issue takes his gun up the street, my store takes care of it and sends it back to me, and I authorize the return and credit or warranty work at no further expense to the customer. Three days later or the same day if it’s an exchange he’s back in the water.

ps- the Dentex in the first picture is arguably the hardest and smartest fish to spear in the Med, tried an AIrbalete the first time on that trip. The black grouper is the world record I landed on a pole-spear last year (does not require an AIRbalete).

 

[Mark Laboccetta]

Thanks Ulysses. I asked way back in this thread whether the "Airbalete" floated and the reply when it eventually came was that it did, may have come from Mark Laboccetta. I never thought that it would be a floater with spear, but was sceptical that it would float without one due to the low water displacement of a smaller pressure air reservoir

Popgun Pete - contrary to what some say the gun is ballasted to be as close to neutral with the spear as possible, and slightly negative.

If it's "front heavy", as previously mentioned, the correct term is "muzzle/wrist heavy", (spearguns have muzzles in the front and a handle has a tendency to feel wrist heavy if mass isn't distributed correctly), then why does it stand up vertically in a muzzle up position when it's floating w/o the spear???

More simply, the gun has higher buoyancy in the front of the gun and everyone, well not everyone..., including the magazine that have tested it will tell you that even the 110 is extremely well balanced and is not muzzle heavy while aiming. If anything most think its too lite because of the bulbous hydroformed muzzle end, until they realize there is no appreciable recoil.

 

[popgun pete]

Well great to finally have an answer, the guns float without spear and muzzle up! I never for one moment assumed that they floated with the shaft installed. Thanks Mark for the clarification.

 

[popgun pete]

The "Airbalete" is now being advertised on the web here (up north) for AU$999, but recently is being offered at AU$50 off that price as a special. Seems pretty expensive even allowing for the shipping to Oz and other costs. The AU dollar is now worth around 90 US cents.

Adrenaline Spearfishing Supplies

 

[ulysses]

Back to the topic of performance: airbalete vs dry barrel airguns

No surprises in a comparative analysis recently published on bluworld.com:

(1) Tovarich kitted Seac Caccia HF 90 outperforms Tovarich kitted Asso 75
(2) Tovarich 75 & 90 outperform Mamba 90
(3) All 3 dry barrel airguns outperform Airbalete 90

More on this test: TEST AIRBALETE (luciano.garibbo)

Cheers, ulysses

 

[spaghetti]

Outperform? Are you sure? I've read Garibbo's test. To me it sounds like it says that the Mamba 90 shoots better than the Aibalete on a <2,5meters target, while the Airbalete 90 shoots better than the Mamba 90 on a >2,5 meters target, in terms of velocity and cynetic energy. Or am I missing something?

 

[tromic]

...
No surprises in a comparative analysis recently published on bluworld.com:

(1) Tovarich kitted Seac Caccia HF 90 outperforms Tovarich kitted Asso 75
(2) Tovarich 75 & 90 outperform Mamba 90
(3) All 3 dry barrel airguns outperform Airbalete 90

More on this test: TEST AIRBALETE (luciano.garibbo)

Cheers, ulysses

My opinion is that one could make real comparative analysis regarding different dry barrel systems only if using same arrow and same line for all the cases.
Tovarich arrow has no slider and the drag could be less than for arrow with the slider and that is the why it could outperform mamba 90. I think there is no significant difference between various dry barrel systems. Mine testing shows that dry barrel is 25 % better than water barrel (with the same arrow and line).

 

[ulysses]

Outperform? Are you sure? I've read Garibbo's test. To me it sounds like it says that the Mamba 90 shoots better than the Aibalete on a <2,5meters target, while the Airbalete 90 shoots better than the Mamba 90 on a >2,5 meters target, in terms of velocity and cynetic energy. Or am I missing something?

Spaghetti, it would appear that Tovarich Asso 75 / Caccia HF 90 outperform Airbalete 90 in all parameters and by far.

It would also appear that the shaft speed advantage of the Mamba 90 over the Airbalete is in the first 2.5 meters. But in the test the Airbalete never catches up (=> tables spazio / tempo).

For you in a parable: If you want to beat Usain Bolt you must cross the finish line before him! There is no good in claiming that at the end of the race, still trailing, you were reducing the gap. rofl

Cordiali saluti
ulysses

 

[ulysses]

My opinion is that one could make real comparative analysis regarding different dry barrel systems only if using same arrow and same line for all the cases.
Tovarich arrow has no slider and the drag could be less than for arrow with the slider and that is why Tovarich could outperform mamba 90. I think there is no significant difference between various dry barrel systems. Mine testing shows that dry barrel is 25 % better than water barrel (with the same arrow and line).

Tromic, I fullly agree. The drag of the slider ("scorrisagola") and the sealing cylinder ("otturatore") on the shaft makes the difference between Tovarich and Mamba.

Cheers, ulysses