Omer XXV Speargun + Other Fast tracking guns?

[Pav]

Sorry, I've missed the Foxfish Oring trick. Can you direct me!

As per the XXV. I have now dropped my 75cm Cressi and use only my Omer XXV 90. The difference is so small that I prefer to just stick with the 90. If the viz is so poor that my 90 is unusable I'd rather not be in hunting.

 

[dotey]

this is the gun i just bought from spetton it is called the AMI 2 it is a very nice gun and loads real fast takes a little time to get use to but works great

 

[Mr. X]

Sorry, I've missed the Foxfish Oring trick. Can you direct me!

As per the XXV. I have now dropped my 75cm Cressi and use only my Omer XXV 90. The difference is so small that I prefer to just stick with the 90. If the viz is so poor that my 90 is unusable I'd rather not be in hunting.

Pav, I see what you mean. The XXV is so light and agile it feels & handles like a smaller gun. I suspect a 90 XXV could have taken all of the fish yesterday - probably enough range & power to reach the bass but agile enough, perhaps, to deal with the mullet in close confines too - maybe. On reflection I'm thinking I should have got the 82cm version as my short gun; the 75 is good though. Or perhaps 90cm version covers all the bases (& basses), as you suggest? [How about a 100cm XXV for the clear waters of Cornwall?]

Probably the previous page of this thread, Foxfish suggested using a rubber band or O-ring around the the spear flopper opening while hunting to stop it swinging open while in the gun. More of an issue for the SA railgun than the XXV but I tried it. Seems to work fine but I probably won't use it on the XXV -- & you probably loose some of the benefit of using a slim 6.3mm spear.

 

[Mr. X]

XXV Muzzle bungeed

BTW I just replaced the neat Omer-supplied muzzle-thread with a piece of 3mm black bungee cord. A thumb knot stops it pulling through the 3mm spear-line hole in the muzzle. I knotted it to the spear-line using a double sheet-bend & added a small O-ring to hold the end neatly against the main bungee. I trimmed & melted the ends with a lighter. It's very neat, low profile & simple. I think this will help resolve some of the tangling issues mentioned (being a single stretchy strand under tension rather than 2 thinner strands under far less tension).

 

[stuckinsurrey]

Finally I got round to the photos. Think that I have it set up correctly. It is a lot more fiddly to load though without the clear plastic guide so when you have the fish swimming around you, taunting you after you've just missed, it takes a lot longer to try and make up for the mistake!:head(from experience yesterday)

 

[Mr. X]

Hi StuckInSurrey,
I see you used regular bungee too but tied a loop to the metal line guide (intended for use with a reel I believe). I removed that metal line guide, as I don't have a reel & it seemed to be in the way (it'll go back in though). I put a single strand of line through the 3mm hole in the muzzle, below the big hole for the the optional bulk rubber. I put a stopper thumb-knot on the right-hand side, which keeps the line tidier than the other way (which I tried first).

There is something of a debate on another thread on which is quicker to load, open or closed muzzles. Once you are used to it you might think differently. Perhaps DeeperBlue could have a "fastest loader" competition to settle this once & for all .

How are you liking the 82cm length?

 

[stuckinsurrey]

Ah, I thought that the metal hoop didnt look quite sturdy enough and now you say it does make an excellent line guide for a reel! Will have to alter it.

I would be bringing up the back of the field on a fastest loader competition for open muzzle. Think its a case of more haste and less speed.

The 82cm is good, the last couple of times we have been out the vis has been pretty good and I have almost wished I had a 90cm. Stood together the difference between my venon 75 and the omer 82 is almost not noticeable (must be a spear length thing).

 

[Mr. X]

Don't know about the strength of the wire but with you guys pulling out 11lb'ers now, perhaps best to be prepared for a big one.

 

[Marwan]

fast loading for open muzzles versus closed muzzles, i think its all about what youre used to ..but if we were to set that aside for argument sake, i think the difference would be less for a short gun like a 75cm, versus say a long 120 with double wrap (those take time and need getting used to)..i imagine a 75 with wingle wrap/reel would be quite quick to load...you can reach from muzzle to butt with both hands easily and wrap the line...

 

[Mr. X]

Range - Reels & bungees

StuckInSurrey, did you get a reel with yours? It looks like Pav has opted to refit his. I led my spearguns out on the floor last night, with the spear lines out to their full extent to compare the range. The difference in range between that of my Omer 75 & RA90 was quite small - around 2 feet. I'm thinking with those powerful 18mm bands you might get a little more range with a reel as I think the spear can pull a little line off the reel.

I think SettingSteel said he was fitting his guns with very long bungees (I need to go back & re-read the post though). I think he might be using bungee instead of mono for most of the length of the spear-line. TBD

 

[azapa]

Re: Omer XXV first impressions in use

THOUGHT: What if bulk rubber only works if you have a rail?!!! Perhaps the down pull element of the bulk rubber will make the XXV inaccurate w/o a rail (the Omer doesn't have the in-line bulk rubber muzzle of a SA railgun & my XXV has no rail). Perhaps that's why they don't ship bulk rubber with the plain XXV (as they do with the Gold). Anybody know if this is an issue? (Does the Gabbiano have a rail? Darn, yes it does. I wonder ... QUESTION: does bulk rubber require a rail to work accurately?)

A thought here, may be I've got hold of the wrong end of the stick, so to speak, but the big advantage of screw in rubber is that the rubbers axis and pull is exactly in line with the spear. The bulk rubber U, through the hole under the muzzle will have a down force on the spear as it is loaded and fired. Those hammerhead muzzles seem to address this issue quite well.

All in all the screwins seem to be a good idea to me.

 

[Pav]

Yes! , now with reel! , I will post some photos at some stage with my rigging. Currently re rigging with double clips and swivels so I can change spears.

 

[azapa]

I took all my swivels and clips off, too noisy, will affect accuracy and add breakage/tangle opportunity waiting to happen. I will start to take a second gun into the water though which will be my solution to the very-stuck-in-head spear situation.

 

[Mr. X]

I found SettingsSteel's post that I mentioned above: http://forums.deeperblue.net/706264-post117.html
Sounds like he is using bungee as a significant portion of the spearline and really likes it. I'm wondering if that might make loading even easier & add a little extra range on the stretch?

I'm with azapa on the swivel/clips, I just removed mine from the RA as they make too much noise (I see the new RA's have a clear plastic sleeve/pipe over the clip presumably to avoid this and the scratching - or perhaps it's just used during shipping?). Worth trying though. I'm using a (double) sheet bend, so that I can untie the spear quickly if necessary but the thin 6.3mm spear & MB recessed barb makeit very easy to pull the spear back through the fish.

....the big advantage of screw in rubber is that the rubbers axis and pull is exactly in line with the spear. The bulk rubber U, through the hole under the muzzle will have a down force on the spear as it is loaded and fired. Those hammerhead muzzles seem to address this issue quite well.

All in all the screwins seem to be a good idea to me.

It's not the screw-ins that give the straight pull, it's the muzzle design - RAs use bulk rubber but have a pull every bit as straight as any eurogun. You're right though, on the Omer XXV the bulk rubber will pull down - but that might be a good thing: the highly accurate Seatec Gabiano (ask Spaghetti how accurate it is) has a downward pull. Is it the wings on the Hammerheads you like? The XXV has a couple of mini wings but I think they are intended (only) for the screw-in rubbers.

With the railed Omer XXV Gold, I would have no concern about using the bulk rubber, as the rail will keep everything straight. My concern was specifically for the unrailed regular XXV, which I have. However, while playing with my spear guns last night I noticed a few tell tale scuffs about 10" along the barrel. While they might have been caused during loading, I suspect they are due to the spear scuffing the barrel during flight; if so, then the issue I was concerned about for bulk rubbers is already happening for screw-in rubbers & the overall impact is insignificant.

I'm lovin' the gun though. Still, need to see if the gun will stand the test of time: I noticed a surprisingly big gouge on the mech probably from when I lowered the gun while bagging a spider crab. I wonder if they don't use fibres to toughen their plastics as RA do?

 

[Mr. X]

Bungee & XXV 75/RA 90

I just put some images of my new muzzle bungees on the http://forums.deeperblue.net/beginner-hunting/64504-dummies-guide-rigging-speargun-10.html thread. Here is a shot of the 90cm RA next to the 75cm Omer -- I still find it hard to believe how little difference in length there appears to be. The difference in feel is huge -- not just due to the length but the construction and philosophy: the RA is designed and made throughout to handle the biggest of game fish, whereas the XXV has been designed and built throughout for lightness & agility. As different as chalk & cheese.

Notice how much more visible the stainless spear is compared to the drab RA spear (drab is good).

 

[Marwan]

Mr X..
the difference in length seems about right..15cm i think youre right about the difference in feel..is the RA also carbon?

 

[Mr. X]

Mr X..
the difference in length seems about right..15cm i think youre right about the difference in feel..is the RA also carbon?

No, my railgun is aluminium. They are available in carbon though. It would be interesting to see how a carbon RA compared.

 

[Marwan]

there you go, a thinnner carbon barrel versus a thicker longer aluminum...definitely the difference in feling will be considerble...

 

[Mr. X]

Hi Pav, how does your XXV compare to your 90cm Comanche?

 

[Pav]

I loved my Comanche 90! , but the loading mech started to fail which is when I replaced it for the XXV.

In my opinion the XXV 90 can replace the 75 and 90 Comanche. I still have a 75 comanche but I only carry it as a spare gun. The 75 has a lot less power than the XXV. I have only needed it when I've been in the rock gardens when I fancy a bit less power with fish sat infront of boulders!

I definately think the comanche 90 felt like you had more gun in the water.

One issue with the comanche is the thread on the rubbers etc is not the same! You are advised to stick to cressi rubbers I think (at least i did).

Only issue I have with the XXV at the moment is the safety latch has gone REALLY loose. I don't use it as a safety but I do have to watch it isn't knocked onto "safe". It used to be very firm and needed a firm push to move it. The comanche safety was secure (you slide it left and right) ... but I always forgot which side was safe. Again not used as a safety as such but i do like to put my gun into safe mode when I unload the rubbers.