Considering he was my safety while I was doing statics and the watch was sitting on the grating at the time, I doubt it.
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AERIS F.10 User Feedback
- Thread starterDoug Krause
- Start date
Thread Status: Hello
, There was no answer in this thread for more than 60 days.
It can take a long time to get an up-to-date response or contact with relevant users.
It can take a long time to get an up-to-date response or contact with relevant users.
Considering he was my safety while I was doing statics and the watch was sitting on the grating at the time, I doubt it.
If you care to, let us know if your friend gets it sorted out.
I deleted my earlier post about this - but this thread exemplifies why most manufacturers don't start threads like this. Users use the thread to trouble-shoot instead of calling tech support, and to vent. You tend to hear mainly from unhappy customers - and they and any happy customers who chime in get into an adversarial thing and the whole bit ends up making the product look bad.
The F10v1 had some problems. My experience was that my first one had the battery warning issue - but only after a thousand or so dives when I'd replaced the battery. That problem was not hard for Aeris to fix - it was a problem with the power useage algorithm that calculates the rate of battery consumption - simple firmware flash that users could download. The batteries were actually lasting quite well. But it got confused with the other issue so they actually ended up fixing it after they fixed the other one - even though it was reported first.
The other issue was a static discharge issue with the buttons. Aeris was never able to duplicate it. They would get a watch back and have absolutely no problems with it - it never occurred for them in hundreds of hours of testing. I never had the problem on my first F10. The fix, which worked, was an hypothesis based on experience they had in the past with another type of unit. The weirdness of the problem made it very hard to nail down - users would send a watch in - get one back with the static issue fixed - but still have the battery issue - which made Aeris think the static fix didn't work.
I was in on this process and talked with the techs - it was a real bitch to sort out.
Neither of these issues represent negligence on the part of Aeris - or even a failure to beta test. They did beta test - with no problem.
For the V2 I've only seen the two incidents reported here. Hopefully both will be sorted out in short order. (if thats all the reports they got they'd probably have the most reliable gauge on the planet!)
I have seen and heard more trouble reports from users of the F10's primary competitor - and quite similar - battery problems, lock ups and display anomalies.
Aeris started this thread in good faith to gather feedback because they were entering into the freediving market. By and large it was good because they did get some good feedback and we all had an opportunity to let them know what we like. But after seeing some of what goes on I told them I did not think it was a good idea. It unnecessarily exposes the public to the trouble-shooting process and ends up as a place for frustrated users to vent. I even saw a lengthy post on another site referenced here wherein the guy roundly condemns Aeris . I don't blame the guy - he did not get good customer service - fell through the cracks. I contacted Aeris and got a promise to get him taken care of even if he was out of warranty. I then contacted him - no reply.
One thing you have to be with any company - especially a relatively small one like Aeris - is persistant and timely. Don't wait - and follow up with them to get the thing resolved. Because I was testing both units I had a special line to Aeris. However - after reading this thread - I started just calling tech support without identifying myself in order to test them. For me they were excellent every time. They didn't even try to trouble-shoot and just rma'd me a new watch immediately.
I deleted my earlier post about this - but this thread exemplifies why most manufacturers don't start threads like this. Users use the thread to trouble-shoot instead of calling tech support, and to vent. You tend to hear mainly from unhappy customers - and they and any happy customers who chime in get into an adversarial thing and the whole bit ends up making the product look bad.
The F10v1 had some problems. My experience was that my first one had the battery warning issue - but only after a thousand or so dives when I'd replaced the battery. That problem was not hard for Aeris to fix - it was a problem with the power useage algorithm that calculates the rate of battery consumption - simple firmware flash that users could download. The batteries were actually lasting quite well. But it got confused with the other issue so they actually ended up fixing it after they fixed the other one - even though it was reported first.
The other issue was a static discharge issue with the buttons. Aeris was never able to duplicate it. They would get a watch back and have absolutely no problems with it - it never occurred for them in hundreds of hours of testing. I never had the problem on my first F10. The fix, which worked, was an hypothesis based on experience they had in the past with another type of unit. The weirdness of the problem made it very hard to nail down - users would send a watch in - get one back with the static issue fixed - but still have the battery issue - which made Aeris think the static fix didn't work.
I was in on this process and talked with the techs - it was a real bitch to sort out.
Neither of these issues represent negligence on the part of Aeris - or even a failure to beta test. They did beta test - with no problem.
For the V2 I've only seen the two incidents reported here. Hopefully both will be sorted out in short order. (if thats all the reports they got they'd probably have the most reliable gauge on the planet!)
I have seen and heard more trouble reports from users of the F10's primary competitor - and quite similar - battery problems, lock ups and display anomalies.
Aeris started this thread in good faith to gather feedback because they were entering into the freediving market. By and large it was good because they did get some good feedback and we all had an opportunity to let them know what we like. But after seeing some of what goes on I told them I did not think it was a good idea. It unnecessarily exposes the public to the trouble-shooting process and ends up as a place for frustrated users to vent. I even saw a lengthy post on another site referenced here wherein the guy roundly condemns Aeris . I don't blame the guy - he did not get good customer service - fell through the cracks. I contacted Aeris and got a promise to get him taken care of even if he was out of warranty. I then contacted him - no reply.
One thing you have to be with any company - especially a relatively small one like Aeris - is persistant and timely. Don't wait - and follow up with them to get the thing resolved. Because I was testing both units I had a special line to Aeris. However - after reading this thread - I started just calling tech support without identifying myself in order to test them. For me they were excellent every time. They didn't even try to trouble-shoot and just rma'd me a new watch immediately.
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I'll see him tonight and will ask.
I understand the difficulties with this sort of thing, but at the end of the day we recommend products to eachother based on our experiences with them and the stories we hear. While I appreciate the company coming on the forum and inviting feedback, which earned them quite a few sales they wouldn't have gotten otherwise, the fact that they disappeared out of the discussion soon after problems became apparent was a black mark. You also assume that if this thread didn't exist that nobody would know about the issues, but that simply isn't true. People post issues about gear when problems happen; manufacturer thread or no.
I realise you're close to the company and don't like it taking a beating that you don't feel is deserved, but you need to be more objective. The fact that they're selling the v2 before the official release is because they have had too many problems with v1. The fact that v2 also has problems means that the people they're selling the watch to are basically beta testers. That's fine, but they should be made aware of this before they buy.
At the end of the day, what would you do in my position? I get asked often what watch to buy, so do I recommend a watch that I don't have complete confidence in to save a bit of money? It's not a one-watch market like it was in the D3 days (a watch that itself had significant problems). The F10 is not the cheapest, not the most reliable, not the deepest and not the most customisable. It's quite a good all-rounder, but the firmware bugs have made many people wary.
I understand the difficulties with this sort of thing, but at the end of the day we recommend products to eachother based on our experiences with them and the stories we hear. While I appreciate the company coming on the forum and inviting feedback, which earned them quite a few sales they wouldn't have gotten otherwise, the fact that they disappeared out of the discussion soon after problems became apparent was a black mark. You also assume that if this thread didn't exist that nobody would know about the issues, but that simply isn't true. People post issues about gear when problems happen; manufacturer thread or no.
I realise you're close to the company and don't like it taking a beating that you don't feel is deserved, but you need to be more objective. The fact that they're selling the v2 before the official release is because they have had too many problems with v1. The fact that v2 also has problems means that the people they're selling the watch to are basically beta testers. That's fine, but they should be made aware of this before they buy.
At the end of the day, what would you do in my position? I get asked often what watch to buy, so do I recommend a watch that I don't have complete confidence in to save a bit of money? It's not a one-watch market like it was in the D3 days (a watch that itself had significant problems). The F10 is not the cheapest, not the most reliable, not the deepest and not the most customisable. It's quite a good all-rounder, but the firmware bugs have made many people wary.
I was told the V2 was officially released a couple of months ago - shortly before I got mine and after a good long beta.
The changes in the V2 are almost all user requests.
And, as mentioned - these here are the only problems I know about. Perhaps you've heard of others.
I'm not aware of any firmware bugs in the V2. As mentioned - if there were firmware bugs we would all experience them. The V1 had one firmware bug that I know of - the battery indicator was wrong. (I might be wrong - the revision log is on my other machine)
You are of course entitled to your opinion - and of course right to go from your own experience. But I think it does help to be as precise as possible.
Mine is different based on the units I tested and reports from Simon.
Also - Takis for what it's worth - I managed to get the '000' etc. screen when I tried to switch to dive mode below the activation depth (the V2 must be manually put in dive mode). I surfaced and was able to switch to dive mode no problem after the BDSI expired (mine is set to 10 seconds). It doesn't sound like what you experienced but I thought I'd post it on the off chance.
The V1 differed in having wet activation.
For the record - the BDSI is at 30 seconds by default - too long for pool training - if you forget to activate free mode you have to wait till the BDSI expires after a dive in order to do so.
The changes in the V2 are almost all user requests.
And, as mentioned - these here are the only problems I know about. Perhaps you've heard of others.
I'm not aware of any firmware bugs in the V2. As mentioned - if there were firmware bugs we would all experience them. The V1 had one firmware bug that I know of - the battery indicator was wrong. (I might be wrong - the revision log is on my other machine)
You are of course entitled to your opinion - and of course right to go from your own experience. But I think it does help to be as precise as possible.
Mine is different based on the units I tested and reports from Simon.
Also - Takis for what it's worth - I managed to get the '000' etc. screen when I tried to switch to dive mode below the activation depth (the V2 must be manually put in dive mode). I surfaced and was able to switch to dive mode no problem after the BDSI expired (mine is set to 10 seconds). It doesn't sound like what you experienced but I thought I'd post it on the off chance.
The V1 differed in having wet activation.
For the record - the BDSI is at 30 seconds by default - too long for pool training - if you forget to activate free mode you have to wait till the BDSI expires after a dive in order to do so.
I apologise if the v2 is officially released. When the guys at the club purchased them a few weeks ago they were told that the v2 was still unofficial and will only see it's release to the channel at the end of the year. That information may not be correct, but it's what the rep told them.
One of the reasons that I'm a bit gunshy about recommending them is that I suggested getting an F10 v2. I understand one of the other guys also had a problem, so I feel like I've suggested a dud to my friends while using something else entirely. To avoid being in that situation again, I'll stick with recommending what I know.
One of the reasons that I'm a bit gunshy about recommending them is that I suggested getting an F10 v2. I understand one of the other guys also had a problem, so I feel like I've suggested a dud to my friends while using something else entirely. To avoid being in that situation again, I'll stick with recommending what I know.
Interesting, seems like it is part of the computers programm. Unfortunately mine didn`t switch to FREE mode outside of the water too.
Nevertheless, today or tomorrow the new one fom Oceanic Europe should arrive. I hop this one will work as intended
Some background and a general question to whoever might know.
I work with digital controls(little computers) on marine air conditioning equipment. Most of these controls are electronically rock solid. They can work flawlessly for years and then suddenly develop completely screwy behavior. Its almost as if an electronic gremlin has taken up residence. Clear the memories, reset the unit and, more often than not, the gremlin disappears forever.
Since freediving computers are, in essence, little computers, does the same thing happen to them?
Connor
I work with digital controls(little computers) on marine air conditioning equipment. Most of these controls are electronically rock solid. They can work flawlessly for years and then suddenly develop completely screwy behavior. Its almost as if an electronic gremlin has taken up residence. Clear the memories, reset the unit and, more often than not, the gremlin disappears forever.
Since freediving computers are, in essence, little computers, does the same thing happen to them?
Connor
As a software developer, I'd have to say it's not generally as simple as that. A reset will often get a device out of an inconsistent state, but it's most commonly a bug that causes said state.
On average, well managed and well written projects have between 1 and 5 bugs per thousand lines of code. The most important thing is to realise this and make your code self-healing. That means that it needs to detect when it is most likely in an inconsistent state and basically restart itself or 'heal' the part that appears to be incorrect. Unfortunately, not nearly enough people write self healing code.
On average, well managed and well written projects have between 1 and 5 bugs per thousand lines of code. The most important thing is to realise this and make your code self-healing. That means that it needs to detect when it is most likely in an inconsistent state and basically restart itself or 'heal' the part that appears to be incorrect. Unfortunately, not nearly enough people write self healing code.
So maybe there are bugs in my controls that are only triggered by very unusual circumstances? You would think that there would be some consistency to the weird behavior we see. But it is almost axiomatic that, if its really screwy and I've never seen the behavior before, a reset will take care of it. There are a few things that I see rarely, but which are recognizable. Often a reset either will not help those, or will only work for a short time. I always assumed that something inside the chip had gone south when that happens.
It's possible that a logic unit would get damaged or that memory has been corrupted, but error checking and correction usually deals with that and you should see problems regularly afterwards.
The usual problem is an obscure bug that puts it in an inconsistent state and the code cannot back it out. A reset means it rebuilds it's state again from scratch and chances are it will be consistent again. The fact the bug is obscure and hard to isolate is generally why testing didn't pick it up
The usual problem is an obscure bug that puts it in an inconsistent state and the code cannot back it out. A reset means it rebuilds it's state again from scratch and chances are it will be consistent again. The fact the bug is obscure and hard to isolate is generally why testing didn't pick it up
takis, if you need any help setting it up let us know here.
For depth use set the activation depth to 1.2m and the BDSI to 30 seconds. To illustrate how BDSI works, if you dive before 30 seconds it will think you are same dive as the previous one, and your dive time will carry on counting. Of course, you don't want this to happen, so tweak the BDSI to be shorter than your recovery time (interval between dives).
The dive log with USB cable etc also works well, just make sure to follow the sequence on the pop-up box as you connect everything.
For depth use set the activation depth to 1.2m and the BDSI to 30 seconds. To illustrate how BDSI works, if you dive before 30 seconds it will think you are same dive as the previous one, and your dive time will carry on counting. Of course, you don't want this to happen, so tweak the BDSI to be shorter than your recovery time (interval between dives).
The dive log with USB cable etc also works well, just make sure to follow the sequence on the pop-up box as you connect everything.
If you use the dive log - don't post here until you've figured it out (it works great but it is not intuitive - work in progress) I'm hoping the guy who does Macdive will get the V2 into it.
For pool training you can set it shallower - but Azapa is right - for open water if you let your arms hang it can activate on the shallowest setting.
(it works great but it is not intuitive - work in progress) I'm hoping the guy who does Macdive will get the V2 into it.For pool training you can set it shallower - but Azapa is right - for open water if you let your arms hang it can activate on the shallowest setting.
Just bought a brand new Aeris f10 V2.. The watch looks great except the back of the case. I can see only 3 screws holding the back of the case in place, i think one is missing. Maybe a factory error? Should i return it for replacement?
Thanks a million bro! iwas thinking about it.. The watch is excellent.. havent tried it yet in water but soon i will.. Somewhere in the manual says about its life time expectation of 7 years only, so sad to read about it... Thanks again