Mares Cyrano 1.1 700 - Questions - Mods & maintenance

[popgun pete]

If you wanted to buy the gun then you would have to deal with the original vendor and have him ship the gun to you as it is already in Oz, so he would have to pay the local shipping. Each time an item is sold the government collects 10 percent of the item cost plus the shipping cost, so it would be avoiding two lots of GST by buying off him. There would be no GST on the local shipping except what that shipper charges, otherwise it is gun plus shipping and that is a chunk of money. All up the gun cost me AUD 444.47 paid through PayPal who collects the GST and sends it to the Tax Office. This gun was "free shipping" as they built that into the asking price. The seller has the option of paying for the gun to return overseas or coming to some other arrangement. I am not into selling spearguns so don't have an ABN number. For now I have to see what the seller has to say, right now he thinks he did me a favour by sending a later gun, but that is not why I bought it and he should have said that before sending it.

 

[popgun pete]

Update from eBay seller in Lithuania is they put the wrong gun in the parcel, probably because they no longer had a Cyrano Evo 70 cm in stock and were only left with the 55 cm and the 40 cm. So they sent the blue handle Cyrano 1.1 70 cm instead. I indicated that I will take the 55 cm Cyrano Evo as it is basically for research purposes, about 11 USD difference in the prices for the sizes with each increment in length. I only bought the 70 cm as the larger guns float, the small ones often don't. The blue gun is a nice gun, but I don't need it, and I don't really need the Evo as a user gun.

Update is the seller doesn't have the Cyrano Evo 55 cm with the power regulator either, so that is that. With a new inner barrel and tank tube you can convert any gun to the longer version. It is a pain in the backside to deal with sellers who don't have the items that they are advertising as the last one and in stock. You hand over the money and it takes a long time to get it back when there is no product to send. Other products in lieu you don't want or you would have bought them in the first place.

 

[popgun pete]

I took some photos when the sun finally came out, you can see the Cyrano 1.3 is very similar to the Cyrano 1.1, but the OD of the muzzles are different as you would expect. At a quick glance they look the same, but the 1.3 muzzle is fatter than the more straight sided 1.1 muzzle.

 

[Pjk]

The 70cm 1.1 comes with that long case it’s no mistake as I received the same.

That is indeed a high price for a plastic mechanism EVO however it is one of the last of its kind brand new and you can add it to the ornamental collection after you dissect its faults.

I would have much preferred the EVO case with my 1.1s but hey maybe Mares saved some money supplying short guns with ready made long-gun case stock,

There is need for a separating shaft pocket/seam sewn into the length of the bag which would save the outer tank barrels finish from any unnecessary damage when everything is bundled together on the move.

Appreciate waiting out the clouds to shine on the 1.3/1.1 side by side,

I cannot decide whether a 1.1 90cm with dry barrel would be better for my single long gun purchase than a 1.3 90cm wet barrel with its 13mm inner barrel compression ratio or whatever and the more desirable 8mm shaft for faster loading and superior penetration.

The 1.1 would be lighter due to the smaller 11mm inner barrel being filled with air & having all dry barrel guns in my arsenal keeps things similar.

It’s very unfortunate they didn’t create a sealed muzzle kit for the 1.3 - 13mm barrel because I want that setup.

 

[popgun pete]

The Mares carry case does separate the gun, spear and handpump, while the zip lock plastic bag with speartip, hand loader and line goes in the pocket at the opening where the instructions are. You need to put everything in the carry case first with the gun going in last, sliding it over the top of the pocket and make sure that the power selector knob does not snag anything. For actual diving use a toweling gun bag, that is the best option, as the cloth carry case is more a transport case, not a dive bag.

I expect that the new Force muzzle screws onto the Cyrano 1.3 because basically that is what it is, a slightly restyled Cyrano. The 8 mm shaft gives more hitting power if you have the gun well pumped up. In the Mediterranean they seem to like thinner shafts for the fish that are left after decades of fishing, whereas here there are tougher fish to overwhelm.

 

[Pjk]

1.3 Cyrano with the Force muzzle sounds ideal we need to verify that it does fit directly onto the 1.3 barrel & thread.

Otherwise a 1.1 90 with a dry muzzle would be adequate.

Mares have a higher functional bar limit that can’t be fully utilised by current vacuum seal setups since the shock absorbers, pistons and seals break however those limits need to be tested using newer more durable parts available from Pelengas such as the disc shock absorbers and higher quality vacuum seals.

 

[popgun pete]

I have shot most fish with my Sten and Scubapro Magnum, I found the 11 mm guns a bit weak, but easier to load. The thinner shafts travel faster initially, but the 8 mm are more deadly at a distance. Originally all guns were 13 mm, that was the standard size. The 11 mm guns only really arrived when people were shooting slim spears with Arbaletes and the pneumatic gun manufacturers decided to go with that trend as their own sales were declining. That was when the original long snout Cyrano appeared. If you want to blow a hole in something, 8 mm is the way to go. Now the muzzle relief ports are so big I don't really think you need a dry barrel on a Sten or a 13 mm Cyrano.

Marketing departments make claims to sell guns, but don't believe all you read in gun adverts, standard features get talked up which are not even new.

 

[Pjk]

Thanks for your honesty,

The smaller 11mm is great but it might not penetrate a fish at 4metres so that fact alone has me tripping over that slight power increase provided by the larger internal barrel and greater impact from the 8mm shaft.

 

[popgun pete]

You don't really need a more powerful gun if you can close the shooting distance and reduce the chances of a miss. I don't see many adverts for the new Mares Force gun and its announcement may precede its actual production. Similarly Sporasub, which was then owned by Omer, announced the One Air well before anyone could buy one. Some dodgy retail outlets advertised the guns, but were using photos of the prototypes which were somewhat different from the final gun. I expect Salvimar may eventually offer a muzzle for the Cyrano 1.3 as basically they just have to machine down the rear section as they already do for the 11 mm Evo and Cyrano 1.1. A lot will depend on how many Cyrano 1.3 guns are actually in use and whether there is a demand for a vacuum muzzle kit. Given the big muzzle ports on the Cyrano I.3 I doubt the need for such a kit.

 

[Pjk]

The staff from Pelengas sent these new shock absorbers in place of the regular black & green shock absorber for the Cyrano Evolution 11mm Vacuum muzzle mod and assured me they would fit & are of a higher quality than the originals


Unsure which position these sit in the new aluminium muzzle rear, raised bumps forwards or backwards,
Finger crossed the pelengas shock absorber design and materials are more durable than the salvimar one & might allow for operation using higher pressure if the piston holds up.

 

[popgun pete]

Those are used in the Pelengas gun without a separate anvil body. There should be two softer ones and a slightly firmer one, the latter is the anvil face. You can see them here in the Varvar gun. Originally Pelengas used two bushes, then increased it to three in later models.

 

[Pjk]

I’ll have another look before I put them in the muzzle but there seemed to be no difference between the dampers they sent apart from a slightly raised surface error on the rear outer diameter of one of them
.
I won’t file down, cut or interfere with the partially raised erroneous edge looking one but I will order a couple more to compare in the coming weeks and maybe replace that one after some use.

I will place the distorted one in the middle for now and hopefully nothing comes from it.

Those salvimar shock absorbers looked easy to destroy so I’m happy they sent these.

There is a heavier replacement black salvimar piston in the older 70 which ill be using with the new vacuum barrel so hopefully everything holds up at 25 bar.

 

[popgun pete]

Those dampers are really intended for the Pelengas muzzles that are retrofitted to Mares and Cressi guns, the coaxial barrel models that the latter have been churning out for years.

What vacuum muzzle guns are available off the shelf?

So it seems to me no rocking of the slider is possible in muzzle - the slider fits into the muzzle with very low tolerances. That is good for reliable sealing and precise shooting, but one must be very careful not to bow the shaft during loading.. That is what I dislike...

forums.deeperblue.com

 

[Pjk]

Those dampers are really intended for the Pelengas muzzles that are retrofitted to Mares and Cressi guns, the coaxial barrel models that the latter have been churning out for years..

It’s handy having parts interchangeable with other brands, Pelengas and Salvimar appear to have decent sometimes higher quality replacements parts like pistons & muzzles with 17-4 hardened shafts for shorter length models & superior line connectors.

 

[popgun pete]

Just be aware that parts are not generally interchangeable, their complete muzzles may be, but not the constituent parts.

 

[Pjk]

In the vacuum muzzle thread above they mentioned placing a stainless steel washer into the three Delrin damper ring configuration, should it go at the front or the back?
Front being the seal, back being towards the trigger

Hopefully won’t ruin the piston

 

[popgun pete]

I would not put a metal washer in there, the Pelengas pistons are plastic and just run into those soft washers. The Mares piston is designed to fit into the curved recess in the plastic shock absorber anvil face.

 

[Pjk]

There are three options regarding the ideal shaft makeup for a vacuum seal on an 11mm barrel with a 7mm shaft,

The Devoto slide keeps things even having two line entry points whereas the other has only one side connecting the line, can’t say which would be lighter and more accurate but I’m leaning toward getting the Devoto to keep things symmetrical to ensure similar results as to now since I have a plastic version of the connector slide.

Presuming they are of similar weight (the 7mm pelengas slide only comes in 17-4 steel now instead of titanium) the one sided loop connection might stray the shaft trajectory slightly like a fin, that’s my only concern.

There’s also more drag on a looped connection using a Devoto slide vs a single connection on the Pelengas version, it’s difficult to choose the true best option here.

Should the shaft tail here also be 17-4 to avoid wear or sticking from a similar constituents 17-4 line connector or does something have to give and we sacrifice the cheapest part here being the tail?

Also brings into question whether a hard steel shaft tail making repeat contact with the SS sear lever is likely to cause degradation over time.

Pelengas don’t specify whether the tails are 17-4 like the slider & don’t offer them in titanium.

Devoto Stainless Steel Line Connector:


Pelengas shank & Line Connector ^

The third option is keeping the stock muzzle alignment ring and the plastic slider.

Surely one of these setups travels more efficiently with greater alignment fitting into the Salvi Vac muzzle seat & ultimately performs better overall than the others.

 

[popgun pete]

The main thing with sliders or line slides is some are really only suitable for mono and that is the shooting line that the guns are often supplied with. Bar the shafts which are usually the PH 17-4 spring stainless, the spear tail and sliders are plain stainless steel. Stop rings are usually stainless steel as well. The original idea with line slides was line trailed in the wake of the shaft and so was mounted on either side of the slider, or attached to trailing wire legs, but to reduce cost and weight these more bulky units have disappeared. I don't think it makes much difference on medium shots and plastic line slides are used because they are cheap. Salvimar makes a twin ear line slide, but you don't see it on their guns. It is a traditional shape that has been around for decades. Remember we are not William Tell shooting an apple off a kid's head, guns just have to be good enough to do the job.

New Salvimar pneumatic gun spear tails and sliders or line slides.

The 2024 Buyer's Guide from Salvimar has this listing of new spear tails and sliders for their pneumatic spearguns.The 45 degree angle on the face of the spear stop diameter and the matching rear face on the stop ring is to create a better passage through the vacuum cuff with the high speed...

forums.deeperblue.com

 

[Pjk]

The three ring shock absorbers Pelengas sent in place of the original Salvimar EVO 11mm damper (the one with the green/black rubber rings on a plastic body) don’t fit as it appears they’ve sent 13mm rings which is interesting because they assured me their Pelengas are better & interchangeable then sent me the wrong size.

I finally had time to attach the Salvimar Vacuum muzzle and it would appear the Pelengas cup seals do fit but they need to be squeezed in.

Also I had found most if not all Pelengas cup seals had tags of extra unwanted material on the inner seal diameters,

I pray these random tags won’t peel further than the rim edge into the cup if they catch and drag on shaft release,

I checked the Original Salvimar cup seal that came with the muzzle & it’s clean cut, perfect.