Static PB's

[efattah]

I've been making many pb's in the water recently and I'm in the worst cardio/endurance shape of my life. I switched all my training to power training and I still beat my old pb's.

At the same time, when I think back to when I was in very good cardio shape, I did have fantastic apnea ability (still less than now), but my blood pressure back then was far too low (decreased vascular resistance & decreased BP are negative side effects of endurance training).

After power training, my BP stays nice and high, so I don't suffer as many sambas/BO's, even if my body is not as efficient.


Eric Fattah
BC, Canada

 

[pkotik]

POWER TRAINING

Eric, have you detailed somewhere what it is you mean by power
training ? Enquiring minds want to know !

 

[efattah]

Power training = short, maximum effort muscle contractions.

A training session typically lasts less than 45 minutes.

The biggest problem is how to avoid injury to tendons / ligaments / joints.



Eric Fattah
BC, Canada

 

[gerard]

Walrus

you must train within your abilities to recover. Apnea is not much different that any other anaerobic type of exercise (sorry Eric when I stated few days ago that diving up in apnea was basically aerobic, I totally forgot the idiosyncrasy of this type of activity). it means that if you overdo it you'll overtrain. And overtraining is a complex issue which involves many factors: Inadequate recovery between training sessions, excessive amounts of high-intensity (and sometimes high-volume) training, sudden changes in training load (distance, duration or intensity), intense strength training, frequent competition and travel, monotony in training programme, no off-season, etc.

BTW, I am not a beginner.

Regards, gerard.

 

[ivan]

hi

Eric when you say short maximum effort are you talking about lifting weights.

cheers

 

[TRITON]

Conclusion

So,people, after all discusions can we make some conclusions about what to do ,and what not to in training that concerns freediving?I know that many issues in apnea are still pretty unknown ,but I'm sure there are certain things that everybody agree about.

 

[ivan]

hi

I think we can agree with some things but others well. I prefer to use all the info I get and develop my own techniques or training methods

cheers

 

[TRITON]

I agree with you Ivan ,but all those informations .....for example "one says thats something is good and recommends it,and the other says its not good ".....thats very confusing.

 

[ivan]

hi

Sure does get confusing but I like to listen to the most experienced

cheers

 

[gerard]

The following is nothing new

but you must always remember it:

First of all the GOLDEN RULE of sports-training:

"Always train within your personal ability to recover"

It also implies that what works for me does not necessarily work for you.

However, specific rules to the golden one have also their play:

1. It's important developing a base for apnea, which is a strong cardiovascular system; therefore endurance type of training is needed (choose exercises which involve the use of larger muscle groups for quicker benefits, i.e. cycling, cross-country skiing (top choice). Some may argue here. I disagree with them.

2. Principle of specifity, which means train apnea to be better at apnea. Statics and dynamics, and combinations of both are a must.

3. Strength training comes later, once you have developed a strong apnea base

4. Meditation and relaxation techniques. Well discussed in this forum.

5. Nutrition (I offered basic guidelines in another post. Click here:
http://forums.deeperblue.net/showthread.php?threadid=32333


Gerard.

 

[Walrus]

Like I said,
The more diving you do, the better you get at it. :duh

If you read about the Japanese AMA divers, they were great freedivers. Many averaged bottom times of 2-3 minutes, this is actually working ie collecting weeds/sponges/oysters !
I would bet most didn't spend their time with exercise routines or strength training. They simply did it as a job, diving many hours each day. They got good at diving from doing wait for it...... lots of diving !

I'm sure many of you know some spearos/freedivers that really don't spend much time exercising, but still have great bottom times ?

Cheers,
Wal

 

[ivan]

hi

Wal I have an old kinda mate well he want a mate but I did talk to him and hang out with him a bit. But he has a job where he is diving all day for Shells and slugs etc on the GBR. He dives 3 weeks on and one week off. He smokes lots of ciggarettets (spelling) as well as the Green stuff. He dives with a working time at 30m with 2mins on the bottom collecting shells etc. I asked him about fitness and he said hes hardly ever done any exercise in his life other than lighting Durries.

BTW I asked him what his best static is he didnt even know what that was and said he had never tried. He also said the main factor to his dives was yoga and relaxation.

cheers

 

[efattah]

I agree that the best way to improve freediving is to freedive.

I also can say, both from my own experience, and from hearing about others, that being a very good freediver does not make you good at endurance events (running, cycling, etc.) This means that the adaptations to diving are different from the adaptations of endurance training.

This does not mean that endurance training does not help. It probably helps. But the ability to perform in endurance events is not required to be a good freediver, which is evidenced by the large number of expert divers who are not in good cardio shape.

In addition, most marine mammals have tons of fat. Endurance training tends to reduce your bodyfat, but from my experience bodyfat is essential to good diving.

So, it is fine to say that 'such and such helps your diving', but we can never say that 'such and such is the best way to train', because the only best way to train must, by definition, be actual diving.

Any training other than diving itself can never help as much as diving.


Eric Fattah
BC, Canada

 

[ivan]

Lets go diving then, Eric have you worked out a way so that you can stay warm enough in the ocean to be in there 24hours a day

cheers

 

[zipy]

hi

ivan look to our animal friends like Eric says

most marine mammals have tons of fat

About diveing. I don't have the luxory to dive every day. I can dive for two weeks in summer and some weekends (if I am lucky).
So for me training on land is essential.

Zipy

 

[ivan]

hi

Zipy I dont get out diving as often as I would like either, same as you most of my training is dry as well, probably why I suck at diving

cheers

 

[gerard]

Originally posted by efattah
...but from my experience bodyfat is essential to good diving.

?


I thought bodyfat makes you more buoyant, therefore not good for diving, especially if you dive with no added weight.

Correct me if I am wrong.

I agree with the rest of the stuff said here.

When I emphasise so much about endurance and its benefits is because many divers don't have the lack of living by the ocean.

There is also the psychological factor. No matter how fit and willing to dive deep you are, if you don't have the guts to go down there you won't go there. That's for sure.

Regards, gerard bodyfat makes you more buoyant

 

[efattah]

Of course bodyfat makes you more buoyant!

However, buoyancy does not affect your freediving, only a CHANGE in buoyancy has negative effects.

It is difficult to dive deep in an 8mm wetsuit, not because of the buoyancy, but because of the CHANGE in buoyancy.

Wetsuits are compressible, so they contribute to the change in buoyancy (the other big change in buoyancy is your lungs).

Bodyfat, however, is better than the best wetsuit, because it is INCOMPRESSIBLE!!

So, an extra 2lbs of buoyancy from bodyfat can be countered by 2lbs of weight, and there will be no additional buoyancy change, only a minor increase in inertia.

A seal can exhale on the surface and sink down to 1800m at almost a constant velocity, only because the 1000kg of bodyfat is incompressible. If the seal were wearing a 1000kg wetsuit, the seal would be sinking like a rock down there.


Eric Fattah
BC, Canada

 

[Ben Gowland]

I am a bit portly

Hmmm.... I agree that more bodyfat could be useful - if only we could spread it evenly acoross our bodies rather than having it in discrete (or not so discrete in some cases...) pockets.

Do you think this argument woud work against my wife who is insisting that I diet at the moment?

:t

 

[TMcKee]

I am enjoying reading these posts about these super freaks out there that are unknowns. I read about this guy in the S.A.S. who could smoke two packs of cigarettes a day and could out run everyone in his unit, in distance and speed!

I went diving with a guy who runs about 5 miles every few days and his very first static was 1:40 moving around underwater, albeit, not much.

I guess I should add my latest attempt to this post.

4:13. I haven't practiced dry statics in some time now because of all the cardio training.

I will be at 5:30 by the end of this year! Even if I have to lie about it!!!